User talk:Frigoris

Hi there. User:Frigoris has made no edits here (and probably never will). Would you like to take over the username? SemperBlotto (talk) 16:24, 7 June 2013 (UTC)

其

On the page 其 (qí), senses 6 and 8 look somewhat related. Should they be combined? RcAlex36 (talk) 16:51, 21 February 2020 (UTC)

• The current definition list looks a bit disorganized. Perhaps it could be reorganized into three groups: indication (in the senses of that, his, hers, theirs, etc.), modality (intention, imperativeness, estimation), conjunction (condition, choice, etc.), and other usages e.g. as proper name. Would you like to help with that? Thanks!Frigoris (talk) 08:11, 23 February 2020 (UTC)

My brilliant 中英等文巧合字單

So what do you think of my brilliant file?

My role is to just chuck things into it that pop into my head. You (experts) role is to maybe dig some gems out of it for future exploration. Jidanni (talk) 12:08, 28 August 2020 (UTC)

@Jidanni: Thanks! I don't think I'm an expert though. --Frigoris (talk) 13:37, 28 August 2020 (UTC)

Huiyizi

Hello! Is it true that 臧 is a huiyizi [1]? Can you clarify why? --Geographyinitiative (talk) 17:01, 29 August 2020 (UTC)

@Geographyinitiative: According to Yang Shuda 楊樹達, the original sense was enslaved enemy (臣) captured by force (戈, weapons). The Shang oracle-bone script shown on that page lacked the 爿 (OC *zaŋ) phonetic component, which was added at a later stage. The sense of "captive" was attested frequently in Zhou bronze, which lingered on into the Han dynasty (see quotation, also Yang Xiong's Fangyan.)

I was using Yang (1965) as reference, which included detailed analyses of the glyph origin of 臧. I should be more specific about components. --Frigoris (talk) 17:27, 29 August 2020 (UTC)

Thanks for your reply! It looks great to me. --Geographyinitiative (talk) 18:14, 29 August 2020 (UTC)

基輔／基辅 (Jīfǔ)

Hi, could this be borrowed from Russian Ки́ев (Kíjev) or even English Kiev instead? It looks like the Chinese names of some Ukrainian cities were borrowed from Russian instead of Ukrainian (e.g. 利沃夫 (Lìwòfū) and 哈爾科夫／哈尔科夫 (Hā'ěrkēfū)). RcAlex36 (talk) 05:10, 21 January 2021 (UTC)

@RcAlex36, thanks. The situation is kinda analogous to the Kyiv/Kiev debate. See new entry: 基也輔／基也辅 (Jīyěfǔ) for the (manifestly) Russianized version. --Frigoris (talk) 08:15, 21 January 2021 (UTC)

Also, where would 阿拉木圖／阿拉木图 (Ālāmùtú) be borrowed from? I don't think this name was used during the Qing dynasty. RcAlex36 (talk) 08:51, 21 January 2021 (UTC)

@RcAlex36, I've no idea. Presumably something to do with Алма-Ата (Alma-Ata)/Alma-Ata (sometimes transcribed as 阿爾木圖 in Chinese in the olden days, but I'm yet to get hold of an authentic copy of the text.) --Frigoris (talk) 09:31, 21 January 2021 (UTC)

Can it be borrowed from Kazakh Алматы (Almaty)? Though I'm not sure if Almaty was known by that Kazakh name back then. RcAlex36 (talk) 09:39, 21 January 2021 (UTC)

@RcAlex36, sorry, I've no idea. --Frigoris (talk) 10:32, 21 January 2021 (UTC)

野路子 (yělùzi)

I'm not sure if I'm phrasing sense 2 correctly (as in 野路子出身 as opposed to 科班出身). Could you please take a look? Thanks. RcAlex36 (talk) 04:35, 23 January 2021 (UTC)

@RcAlex36, thanks! Could you provide an example? --Frigoris (talk) 16:42, 23 January 2021 (UTC)

Here are some examples I've fetched online:

• 有同学说是从自学编程出身的，碰到过很多的问题，和很多人一样，我也是野路子出身的，2000 年自学 Asp 编程，大学期间兼职给别人做了不少网站。但那时候拿到一个项目，上手就是写代码，没有对需求进行梳理分析，也没有设计，直接就是想到哪写到哪。
• 野路子诗人和科班诗人最大的区别是什么？
• 在炒股方面，金融科班出身和野路子自学成才有多大差别？
• 我好像不能算数学系科班，我是个转专业的，知乎至今还有不少优秀的数学博士认为我是野路子。
• 科班学习的摄影师，理论知识更丰富，摄影基础比野路子摄影师（天赋选手除外）强太多了好吧，

RcAlex36 (talk) 17:09, 23 January 2021 (UTC)

Also @沈澄心. RcAlex36 (talk) 17:14, 23 January 2021 (UTC)

@RcAlex36, some words for your consideration: an unschooled person; autodidact; amateur; dilettante --Frigoris (talk) 17:23, 23 January 2021 (UTC)

(notice that autodidact is fairly neutral and may even carry an air of praise [for the dedication to one's self-improvement]. In your examples the word seems to be used with some irony) --Frigoris (talk) 17:26, 23 January 2021 (UTC)

"[ADJ] person" sounds more like 野路子出身的人 than 野路子 to me. --沈澄心✉ 04:50, 25 January 2021 (UTC)

Quote at 庸詎

I've added a quote from Zhuangzi, but its translation of d by James Legge seems off. Would you mind writing a better translation? Thanks a lot. RcAlex36 (talk) 13:33, 17 May 2021 (UTC)

@RcAlex36,  Done - it's a very convoluted sentence. Hopefully it's a bit less convoluted now. --Frigoris (talk) 14:31, 17 May 2021 (UTC)

Thanks a lot. I'm also having trouble translating a definition of 澆薄.

* 漢語大詞典 gives 指社會風氣浮薄

* 國語辭典 gives 人情、風俗淡薄

* 現代漢語詞典 gives （人情、风俗）刻薄；不淳厚

Could you please take a look and offer some suggestions as to how to translate it this definition? RcAlex36 (talk) 15:02, 17 May 2021 (UTC)

@RcAlex36, I'd suggest mean (adj) (as in unkind); that is, lacking understanding, generosity, or goodwill. How do you think about it? --Frigoris (talk) 17:50, 17 May 2021 (UTC)

Translation request

Hi, your edit at 埠 was really insightful. It reminds of of 祿步 which I edited a while ago.

I am having some difficulty translating the quote I've added earlier at 朝鮮. How would you translate "朝鮮民族主義者幻想從美國和巴黎和會那裡「乞求」朝鮮獨立，而不依靠朝鮮人民用武力實現朝鮮獨立。" into English? RcAlex36 (talk) 14:15, 26 May 2021 (UTC)

@RcAlex36, thanks. Possibly something like..

"In their deluded mind the Korean Nationalists (?) would rather beg for independence from the Americans or the Paris Peace Conference than achieve it by the Korean people's armed struggle." --Frigoris (talk) 14:28, 26 May 2021 (UTC)

Is deluded too strong a word though? Any milder alternatives? RcAlex36 (talk) 14:29, 26 May 2021 (UTC)

@RcAlex36, good point.. probably deluded mind illusion would be better --Frigoris (talk) 14:32, 26 May 2021 (UTC)

百廢待興

I've created the entry 百廢待興 and added a usage example. Please feel free to improve the translation of the definition and the usex. RcAlex36 (talk) 09:52, 30 May 2021 (UTC)

@RcAlex36, thank you! I think the entry is already good as it is. I'll add some quotations if I can find any good sources. --Frigoris (talk) 15:15, 30 May 2021 (UTC)

王、親王

The definitions of these two terms should probably be modified.

王 has the definition 秦漢以來皇帝對親屬、臣屬的最高封爵 in 漢語大詞典 and 古代封建社會中地位在公侯之上的爵位。秦漢以後，天子的伯叔兄弟及異姓藩王均稱為「王」 in 國語辭典, but I'm not sure how to translate that.

漢語大詞典 defines 親王 as 皇帝或國王近支親屬中封王者, so it should perhaps be defined as a close male relative of the king or emperor (in the paternal lineage?) given the title of "prince". RcAlex36 (talk) 14:12, 1 June 2021 (UTC)

@RcAlex36, thanks for the notice. I'll probably take a glance at the Tongdian which has tonnes of stuff related to these definitions. --Frigoris (talk) 18:36, 1 June 2021 (UTC)

首當其衝

Could you please translate the quotes in the etymology section into English, as well as modify the section as you see fit? RcAlex36 (talk) 18:10, 4 June 2021 (UTC)

Quote at 見怪

In 愚直之言，幸勿見怪！, I'm not sure if it's 愚直 ("愚笨而戇直") or 愚 ("I") + 直 ("blunt"). Please change it if I've made a mistake. RcAlex36 (talk) 15:42, 19 June 2021 (UTC)

@RcAlex36, I tend to follow the former. I don't feel like going through metonymic hurdles when a direct route leads to clear understanding.  Done --Frigoris (talk) 16:45, 19 June 2021 (UTC)

呼圖克圖‎

Please feel free to supplement the definition of 呼圖克圖, since you are more familiar with Buddhism and there seems to be relatively little information on what a khutuktu is on the Internet. RcAlex36 (talk) 14:52, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

@RcAlex36, hello, I'm only a tiny little bit familiar with some Sanskrity stuff. This term looks like of Mongolian or Tibetan origin. Sorry I don't think there's anything I could help. --Frigoris (talk) 15:46, 24 June 2021 (UTC)

被子

Hi, in your opinion, should 被子 be glossed as "blanket", aside from "quilt"? RcAlex36 (talk) 14:14, 14 July 2021 (UTC)

@RcAlex36, hi, I don't think they're the same. Is this a dialect thing? --Frigoris (talk) 19:09, 14 July 2021 (UTC)

(also @Justinrleung, Suzukaze-c, The dog2) Here are the definitions of 被子 given in various dictionaries:

• 現代漢語詞典：睡觉时盖在身上的东西，一般用布或绸缎做面，用布做里子，装上上棉花、丝绵、鸭绒等。
• 現代漢語規範詞典：睡觉时盖在身上的保暖物。一般为长方形，由被里、被面、被絮等构成。
• 漢語大詞典：睡觉时盖在身上的东西。一般用布或绸缎做面，用布做里子，内装棉花或丝绵、羽绒等。
• 國語辭典：睡覺時蓋在身上的寢具。一般以棉絮縫在布內，外加被套。也稱為「棉被」。

According to the Oxford English Dictionary,

• blanket: a large oblong sheet of soft loose woollen cloth, used for the purpose of retaining heat, chiefly as one of the principal coverings of a bed; also for throwing over a horse, and as clothing by indigenous peoples and destitute individuals
• quilt: a bed covering consisting of two joined pieces of fabric enclosing a layer of soft material (such as wool, cotton, or down) which acts as padding or insulation
• duvet: a quilt stuffed with eiderdown or swan's-down

So if a covering has a 被套, is it a quilt instead of a blanket? I don't know much about bed coverings, but are 蠶絲被, 羽絨被, 棉被 and 羊毛被 all called quilts? RcAlex36 (talk) 07:51, 15 July 2021 (UTC)

@RcAlex36, Yes, I think if its a jacket plus fillings it can be called a quilt. The blanket is usually a woven piece without fillings. --Frigoris (talk) 09:14, 15 July 2021 (UTC)

I don't know about in China, but in Singapore, I don't think there's a distinction between quilts and blankets in Chinese. That said, Singapore is summer all year round and does not have a winter, so for obvious reasons, we just don't use quilts. The dog2 (talk) 16:11, 15 July 2021 (UTC)

@The dog2, Do you mean the Chinese term 被子 can refer to what is known as the "blanket" in English? --Frigoris (talk) 16:59, 15 July 2021 (UTC)

Yes. Although in Singapore, we usually say 被. The dog2 (talk) 17:31, 15 July 2021 (UTC)

Creating New Categories

Hey I have made a new category called Category:English terms derived from Wade-Giles. However, there isn't any of the "fun stuff" we see at the top of the page in my new category, like we see in this category (for instance) Category:English transliterations of Mandarin terms. I tried to get someone to explain to me how to do this before, but I believe I couldn't understand what they wrote. I would appreciate any guidance or help with determining (1) is this the new category a legit category vis-a-vis Wiktionary policy and (2) how can I add the 'Recent additions to the category' box and other stuff to the top of the new category's page? Thanks for any help. --Geographyinitiative (talk) 22:23, 10 August 2021 (UTC)

@Geographyinitiative, to quote this discussion: Wiktionary:Grease_pit/2021/July#DynamicPageList_and_category_pages

It looks like DynamicPageList, which is used by Module:category_tree to produce "Recent additions to the category" on pages like Category:Japanese lemmas, might be removed soon because the tool is not well maintained and has caused major disruptions to servers

I attempted to add the {{auto cat}} to the category page, but it seems that the underlying code interprets the category's name as "X-language terms derived from Y-language" (e.g. Category:Chinese terms derived from Sanskrit), and since the string "Wade-Giles" is not a language name in the underlying language data, it causes a module error.

About the category itself, I can't see why this can't be a subcategory of "English transliterations of Mandarin terms", for Wade-Giles is indeed a kind of "transliteration of Mandarin terms". But I don't know if the naming is "correct"; it seems to me that in the majority of categories named as "X-language terms derived from Y", the Y refers to a language. Perhaps the Grease Pit is the place to ask about these details, I think. --Frigoris (talk) 07:31, 11 August 2021 (UTC)

場面話

How would you translate this term into English, glossed as "指敷衍应酬的话" in 现代汉语词典 and "公开场合说的应酬话" in 现代汉语规范词典? RcAlex36 (talk) 15:17, 21 August 2021 (UTC)

@RcAlex36: I think the first one is roughly equivalent to "perfunctory remarks", something said but not necessarily meant. The second one is similar to pleasantries or formality, something said for its formal effects but understood to be largely devoid of concrete information by the speaker and listeners alike. --Frigoris (talk) 08:36, 22 August 2021 (UTC)