User talk:Ardahan Karabağ

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Multiple etymologies

My edit message may not have been clear. I was referring to this statement in Wiktionary:Entry layout: "Note that in the case of multiple etymologies, all subordinate headers need to have their levels increased by 1 in order to comply with the fundamental concept of showing dependence through nesting." Vox Sciurorum (talk) 23:46, 21 July 2021 (UTC)

Qaynaqlar

Proto məqalələri oluşturanda qaynaqlar ekləsən nə olur? Allahverdi Verdizade (talk) 05:58, 25 July 2021 (UTC)

Merhabalar, teşekkür ederim bir kaç kaynaktan bakıyordum 1-2 falandır. Ve pek önemsemiyordum ama kaynaklar güvenilirlik ve doğruluk bakımından önemlidir. Kullandığım kaynakları belirtmeye çalışacağım. Bazen belirtemeyebilirim de çünkü Wictionary'de yeniyim :) ama elimden geleni yapacağım. İyi günler... Arbasun (talk) 07:23, 25 July 2021 (UTC)

Görürəm ki əsasən EDALdan istifadə edirsiniz. Pək eyi. Məsələn, dil məqaləsinə baxalım: dil. Görə bildiyimiz kimi əmələ gələn keçid olduqca uzundur. Ona görə Altaic etymologynın yanındakı "+" işarəsinə basıb Turkic: *dɨl / *dil +a tıklayırız. Gördüyümüz kimi əmələ gələn keçid daha qısadır: dil. Keçidin içində belə bir parça var: +84&root. Bu nömrə kökün nömrəsidir. Onu köçürürük və bizim öz şablonumuza salırıq: {{R:trk-pro:SDM|*dɨl / *dil|84}}. Vəssalam.

Sonra, baxırıq EDAL-dakı dil məqaləsəinin lap aşağısına, orda Comments bölümündə daha bir neçə qaynaq var. Onları köçürmək olduqca önəmlidir.

• EDT = {{R:trk:Clauson|page=}}
• VEWT = {{R:trk:VEWT|page=}}
• ЭСТЯ = {{R:trk:ESTJa|page=|vol=}}
• Лексика = {{R:trk:SIGTJa|page=}}
• TMN = {{R:TMN|page=|vol=}}
• Егоров, Stachowski və sairə üçün hənüz şablonumuz yoxdur, hətta onlar önəmli deyillər.

Haydi, Allaha əmanət. Allahverdi Verdizade (talk) 08:37, 25 July 2021 (UTC)

Teşekkür ederim. Anladığım kadarını yapmaya çalışacağım. Aklımda "tepe" kelimesi var birazcık zor olacak çünkü diğer Türk dilleri hakkında pek fazla sözlük yok (aslında benim kullandığım bir tane var ama her sözcük yok). Eğer yaparsam kaynağı belirtmeye çalışağacım. Kendinize iyi bakın... Arbasun (talk) 09:14, 25 July 2021 (UTC)

Qadan alım, Classical Nahuatl hara, Proto-Türkcə hara? Allaha xatir, kefli olanda Vikilüğəti redaktə etməginən. Allahverdi Verdizade (talk) 14:59, 25 July 2021 (UTC)

Evet orada bir hata yapmışım çünkü bir kaynakta görmüştüm. Özür dilerim ve haklısınız 🤔 Arbasun (talk) 17:20, 25 July 2021 (UTC)

Karşılaştırsam bile modern Türkçe ile Azerbaycan dilini karşılaştırmam lazımdı, belki uzun zaman önce yerli Amerika halkı sibiryadayken bu ödünçleme olmuş olabilir. Ama o da çok eskiye dayanır ki pek de olanak yok. Büyük ithimalle bu durum bir tesadüf. Evet birazcık yanlışlık etmişim o konuda. Neyse, kendinize iyi bakın (benim zamanıma göre) İyi geceler... Arbasun (talk) 17:28, 25 July 2021 (UTC)

Davetiye

Merhaba, özel iletişim kurabilmemiz için e-posta adresinize ihtiyacım var. Dilerseniz bir davetiye göndermek istiyorum. BurakD53 (talk) 18:53, 16 August 2021 (UTC+3)

Merhabalar, yaşımın birazcık küçük olduğunu düşünüyorum bunun için ama şimdiden karar vermek istemiyorum. E postam ardahankrbg@gmail.com Arbasun (talk) 16:07, 16 August 2021 (UTC)

akiz

I usually avoid adding inflections to dialectal words, because they are often inflected differently than the standard language. Or are the Turkish dialects regular? I don't know Turkish. Vahag (talk) 21:43, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

As a Turkish speaker, I haven't noticed that this noun exists until you created the entry. But I added the definite accusative and the plural form according to the Turkish grammar rules. That is a dialectal word, so it could be a bit different too. It is not clear. But you are doing the right thing, I'm going to undo. Ardahan (talk) 22:02, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

It is a Hamshen word. You would not have heard it. Vahag (talk) 22:23, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

Comparisons

Adding unsourced Altaic comparisons is not allowed. There is a reason we banned Proto-Altaic and that is the fact that the Altaic family is complete nonsense. All comparisons must be sourced, ideally to something else than EDAL, whose cross-family comparisons are not trustworthy. — SURJECTION ^{/ T / C / L /} 20:38, 20 April 2023 (UTC)

The relationship between these languages are not just because they share a common ancestor, but 100% had some influences and interactions that probably happened very long years ago. Of course there are also going to be linguistically similarities between these languages, which are similar by culture, traditions, sentence structure, urheimat and etc... Are there any agreement about banning Altaic theory on this site? Since I'm new to Wiktionary, I should be aware of that too. Ardahan Karabağ (talk) 20:50, 20 April 2023 (UTC)

On the reconstruction of *béken-

While I understand that the Chuvash form does seem to point to *béken- I don't understand what the root of the verb would be, it indicates a root *bék that does not exist, unless it is a variant of *bég. Yorınçga573 (talk) 22:43, 18 May 2023 (UTC)

Proto-Türkçe'de kökteki *-g- sesi ek alınca benzeşmeye uğrayabilir. *boguŕ (boğaz) > *bokuŕ-dak (Adem elması). Çok büyük ihtimalle burdaki değişim *beken- fiilinde de geçerli. Ardahan Karabağ (talk) 22:48, 18 May 2023 (UTC)

Evet, bana da bu mantıklı geldi. Bu arada yanlışlıkla béken-bégen geri gönderme döngüsüne sokmuşuz X). Yorınçga573 (talk) 22:50, 18 May 2023 (UTC)

Ben de anlamadım eski haline götürecektim de beceremedim. 2 yıldır bu sitedeyim bir türlü bazı şeyleri beceremedim :D Ardahan Karabağ (talk) 22:52, 18 May 2023 (UTC)

Şu an düzelmiş, bég'den gelme olasılığını da yazıyorum. Yorınçga573 (talk) 22:52, 18 May 2023 (UTC)

👍🏻 Ardahan Karabağ (talk) 22:53, 18 May 2023 (UTC)

We did not reconstruct it, see in beğenmek, reconstruction is coming from EDAL. If it comes from the word bey, bey has a long vowel. EDAL reconstructed it correct. It's not clear that it comes from bey. BurakD53 (talk) 01:45, 19 May 2023 (UTC)

I only added it as a plausabality. I also don't see why it needs a long vowel in reconstruction, none of the descendents appear to point to it. Yorınçga573 (talk) 04:57, 19 May 2023 (UTC)

Turkmen sometimes loses its long vowel. Also, the intervocalic k after long vowel becomes ğ/g/y in Oghuz. BurakD53 (talk) 12:13, 19 May 2023 (UTC)

Wouldn't VkV already cause it to become g? Ex: *köküŕ? Yorınçga573 (talk) 12:31, 19 May 2023 (UTC)

That's rare. *köküŕ became *kögüŕ in only Oghuz, we see from descendants. All intervolcalic k sounds turn into g/ğ in Kipchak. BurakD53 (talk) 12:43, 19 May 2023 (UTC)

Right, but this does not have Kipchak proof right? So it should remain inconclusive wether or not it has a long vowel, especially considering how uncertain Oghuz can be with its intervocalic -k-. I'm going to add an alternative reconstruction section though. Yorınçga573 (talk) 13:09, 19 May 2023 (UTC)

If it had a long vowel as kööküz, it would be written as gögüs in Turkmen, but it's göwüs, from kögüz. BurakD53 (talk) 13:18, 19 May 2023 (UTC)

Yeah, fair enough Yorınçga573 (talk) 13:26, 19 May 2023 (UTC)

Working link for Etimologičeskij slovarʹ tjurkskix jazykov

Do you have a working link for a pdf of Etimologičeskij slovarʹ tjurkskix jazykov? The one in the references section leads to an error page for me, thanks in advance =) Yorınçga573 (talk) 15:27, 3 July 2023 (UTC)

I do have only volume 5 and 3 I guess, write your e mail here, I'll send you. Ardahan Karabağ (talk) 15:42, 3 July 2023 (UTC)

I'd rather not share my email here, do you have Discord? I'll send you mine if so Yorınçga573 (talk) 15:44, 3 July 2023 (UTC)

I don't use dc so much but I have an account, you can send Ardahan Karabağ (talk) 15:45, 3 July 2023 (UTC)

Ok it's "emstar" (just that, as dc removed the numbers) Yorınçga573 (talk) 15:46, 3 July 2023 (UTC)

Ana Türkçe *teŋ ile ilgili

Selam,

Teŋ sayfasına koyduğunuz Eski Çince kökene bir kaynak gösterebilir misiniz? Göstermezseniz etimoloji başlığını sileceğim. Saygılarımla,

Newgrass 82 (talk) 05:28, 23 April 2024 (UTC)

Gerard Clauson Çince kökenli olmadığını söylemekle birlikte, Çince bir kaynak olan Xiandai Hanyu Cidian'ın 227. sayfasında ve Räsänen'in “Versuch eines Etymologischen Wörterbuchs der Turk-Sprachen (Helsinki, 1969)" eserinde de Çince olduğu yazmaktadır. Ardahan Karabağ (talk) 14:06, 23 April 2024 (UTC)