Talk:euery

RFD discussion: March–April 2014

The following information passed a request for deletion.

This discussion is no longer live and is left here as an archive. Please do not modify this conversation, but feel free to discuss its conclusions.

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euery

We don’t want to include typographical forms, do we? --Æ&Œ (talk) 18:57, 16 March 2014 (UTC)

• It's a wonderfoolism. Delete SemperBlotto (talk) 19:03, 16 March 2014 (UTC)

  Keep like we kept vp (see the arguments made on Talk:vp), and seem to be poised to keep WT:RFD#dies_Iouis. And convert to use {{obsolete typography of}}, obviously. (Yes, there are a lot of 'u' forms of 'v' words and vice versa, which some bored person can increase their edit count by making, if this entry is kept and our inclusion of such things reaffirmed.) - -sche (discuss) 17:49, 17 March 2014 (UTC)

  @SemperBlotto Using the word "wonderfoolism" is only gonna establish it as real word. --WikiTiki89 18:07, 17 March 2014 (UTC)

  I believe the correct term is wonderfolly. —Aɴɢʀ (talk) 18:27, 17 March 2014 (UTC)

  Wonderfoolery? Keφr 18:54, 17 March 2014 (UTC)

Delete. I oppose the inclusion of typographical variants. — Ungoliant ^(falai) 18:59, 17 March 2014 (UTC)

• Keep for consistency; I'm also sure there's some word out there where the knowledge of whether u was used for u or v is lost.--Prosfilaes (talk) 21:07, 19 March 2014 (UTC)

• Keep. People will look it up.​—msh210℠ (talk) 15:48, 21 March 2014 (UTC)
• Keep (as soft redirect). Ƿidsiþ 16:13, 22 March 2014 (UTC)

Are uue going to do yis for euery uuord uuith ſuch letters? Chuck Entz (talk) 16:45, 22 March 2014 (UTC)

For words like euery, where v↔u: yes. For words like ſuch: no. For uue: probably.

We've tended to delete spellings if they differed from other spellings only by the use of a different form of a letter: hence fisherwoman (with ligature 'fi') was deleted and only fisherwoman was kept, The (with uppercase 'T') was deleted and only the was kept, and diſtinguiſh and repræſentation (with long ſ) were deleted and only distinguish and repræsentation were kept. All of those are variations the site's search can handle: if you type fisherwoman into the search, it brings up the pages that use fisherwoman; long ſ is even something our "Did you mean...?" function can handle. (Can that function also be made to handle ligatures like fi?) Humans and automatic functions can learn that fi → fi in all pagetitles except that of the entry of [[fi]] itself.

In contrast, we've tended to keep forms if they differed from other forms by the use of a different letter: hence there are entries for both academise and academize, and vp (not just up) was kept, and we're poised to keep dies Iouis (not just dies Iovis). This is because alternation of two separate, still-used letters is not something that can be predicted accurately by human users (especially non-native speakers) or site functions like the site search and (as Ruakh noted on Talk:diſtinguiſh) the "Did you mean ...?" function. In many cases, both spellings are words in other languages: for example, ever is a word in Dutch and euer is a word in German, so neither one can redirect to the other, and the site search cannot know when a person looking up the word euer might be looking for ever. (This is also a reason we have English entries for words spelt with æ.)

- -sche (discuss) 19:09, 22 March 2014 (UTC)

• Keep. If nothing else, at least the most frequent 1,000 words in English should get entries for once-common orthographic typographical variants. Would be nice if they had a usage note explaining or linking to the relevant orthographic bit of history of typography or of the Latin alphabet or whatever would be appropriate for readers of modern English. (euery/every usage comparison according to Google ngrams) —Pengo (talk) 06:31, 23 March 2014 (UTC)

  This is not an orthographic variant. It was used when V and U weren’t considered distinct letters. — Ungoliant ^(falai) 06:37, 23 March 2014 (UTC)

  My mistake. Regardless, it's not knowledge a typical user looking up the the word today is expected to have. —Pengo (talk) 06:44, 23 March 2014 (UTC)

Keep. This is not typographical or stylistic variant. It is a historical spelling, based on changed identities of letters. Also, everything sche wrote. —Michael Z. 2014-03-26 17:30 z

Kept. bd2412 T 21:06, 28 April 2014 (UTC)

Related discussions

See list on Talk:vp. - -sche (discuss) 04:06, 6 June 2016 (UTC)