Module talk:grc-decl

See also: Template talk:grc-adecl

This talk page handles inquiries related to {{grc-decl}} and {{grc-adecl}}.

Archives

• 2015–2018

-ύς epic declension

Hi! I've just noticed in ὠκύς an error regarding the Accusative plural of Epic declination of -ύς adjectives: ὠκεῖς (contracted) is Attic, while Epic has ὠκέας (e.g. Iliad 24.14: "ἀλλ᾽ ὅ γ᾽ ἐπεὶ ζεύξειεν ὑφ᾽ ἅρμασιν ὠκέας ἵππους"). Thank you very much! --Epìdosis (talk) 14:59, 6 January 2019 (UTC)

@Epìdosis: I put this off for a while. It looks like the nominative plural should be -εες and the accusative plural -εᾰς, though Smyth (§ 296 D) doesn't clearly say this. I did a little survey of words with -εις and -εες in Homer, and it looks like all or most the nouns or adjectives of this type are in the -εες list. So I'll make the change. — Eru·tuon 00:03, 12 January 2019 (UTC)

-εες is also true, I had forgotten it. Thank you very much, --Epìdosis (talk) 09:03, 12 January 2019 (UTC)

Suppressing adverbs

At δολιχόσκιος (dolikhóskios) I wrote {{grc-adecl|...|adv=-}} as Template:grc-adecl/documentation says I should, but the adverb was generated anyway. What's going on? —Mahāgaja · talk 20:08, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

@Mahagaja: Hmm, |sup=- also doesn't work. I must have done something to break it. I'll take a look. — Eru·tuon 21:14, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

Not sure what I did, but it's fixed now. — Eru·tuon 21:21, 5 February 2019 (UTC)

Error in -εις/-εσσᾰ/-εν adjectives

@Erutuon: At σκιόεις I have to specify |MNS=σκῐόεις explicitly. If I just write {{grc-adecl|σκῐόεις|εσσᾰ}} then the template generates a masculine nominative singular *σκῐόε̄ς (*skióēs) with an epsilon marked as long. Can this be fixed, please? —Mahāgaja · talk 20:17, 14 May 2019 (UTC)

@Mahagaja: Fixed. Added a testcase so this won't happen again. — Eru·tuon 20:36, 14 May 2019 (UTC)

Bugs or missing features

Working list from archive. Should not be archived.

— This unsigned comment was added by Erutuon (talk • contribs) at 06:13, 1 June 2019‎.

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Bugs or missing features:

• ἠώς (ēṓs): title of table. Param |title= does not override title. ἄργματα.2024.02 title=in the plural.
• σύμπαν (súmpan): no dative plural generated for substantivized adjective
• τράχηλος (trákhēlos): heteroclitic (masculine singular, neuter plural); can't put both in one table
• Homeric first-declension genitive plural in -ῶν (-ôn) mainly after a vowel; does Ionic use -ῶν (-ôn) after a vowel (or elsewhere), or only -έων (-éōn)?
• Allow πῑ́ων, πῑ́ειρᾰ, πῖον (pī́ōn, pī́eira, pîon) to be shown in table. Add parameters for feminine nominative and genitive singular (or just nominative), to be declined like a noun and added to the feminine part of table? Or, since πῑ́ων is used for both masculine and feminine, allow single-gender adjective table?
• Would be nice to be able to automatically decline ὗς (hûs). Can't currently because stem is the rough breathing!
• εἷς (heîs), οὐδείς (oudeís): declension could be automatically generated if masculine–neuter and feminine were supplied separately.
• ἀαγής (aagḗs): Doric has the same forms in the supposedly "contracted" and "uncontracted" tables.
• ὄν (ón): dative plural is missing a smooth breathing.
• Allow removing case-rows or gender columns from table: for instance, nominative and vocative for ἑαυτοῦ (heautoû), vocative for ἐκεῖνος (ekeînos), neuter for ἐμαυτοῦ (emautoû), σεαυτοῦ (seautoû) and their dialectal forms.
• Need some way to handle θήλεα (thḗlea), feminine of θῆλυς (thêlus).
• Add "fun" Epic dative plurals in -εσσῐ, either always or whenever some algorithm predicts that they make sense metrically in hexameter.
• Allow accent to disappear beyond beginning of suffix in -μενος (-menos)?
• Attic-declension adjectives like ῑ̔́λεως (hī́leōs) need accent on antepenult.
• Attic and Old Attic have contraction, but {{grc-decl|πᾰ́θος|εος|dial=att}} and {{grc-decl|πᾰ́θος|εος|dial=ato}} show uncontracted forms. (Throw error?)
• κᾰθεστώς (kathestṓs) and τεθνεώς (tethneṓs) should have stem in -ωτ (-ōt). But see also Epic ἑσταώς (hestaṓs) with stem in -οτ alongside feminine in -ουσα rather than -υια.
• δηλητηριώδης (dēlētēriṓdēs) — genitive plural should be δηλητηριωδῶν (dēlētēriōdôn), not *δηλητηριώδων (*dēlētēriṓdōn).

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Additions to the above

• Adjectives (and participles) whose feminine ends in -ιᾰ (or -ρᾰ, if there are any) in the nominative singular should take -ιης (-ρης) in the fem.gen.sg. and -ιῃ (-ρῃ) in the fem.dat.sg. in Epic and Ionic. (Example: at αἰπύς (aipús), {{grc-adecl|αἰπῠ́ς|αἰπεῖᾰ|dial=epi}} creates fem.gen.sg. αἰπείᾱς (aipeíās) instead of αἰπείης (aipeíēs). —Mahāgaja · talk 14:43, 3 June 2019 (UTC)

  @Mahagaja: Fixed. — Eru·tuon 18:57, 4 June 2019 (UTC)

Epic genitives in -ε͜ω

@Erutuon, JohnC5: the module is putting the accent on the wrong place for these. For example, at Λαερτιάδης (Laertiádēs) it's creating Λαερτιαδέ͜ω (Laertiadé͜ō) (and incidentally not stripping off that slur mark in the link) rather than Λαερτιάδεω (Laertiádeō). —Mahāgaja · talk 09:31, 25 July 2019 (UTC)

@Mahagaja: Fixed. Module:grc-decl/decl/data had to indicate that Epic has synaeresis of εω in the endings of masculine first-declension nouns, and Module:grc-accent had to recognize the possibility of underties. (I'm still not sure if the declension module correctly accents nouns in Herodotus in which the ending contains εω though.) — Eru·tuon 15:50, 25 July 2019 (UTC)

Attic declension of adjectives

@Erutuon, JohnC5: The template is not generating the correct accentuation of second-declension adjectives with quantitative metathesis (Attic declension); see ἵλεως (híleōs) and λεπτόγεως (leptógeōs). —Mahāgaja · talk 14:56, 15 December 2019 (UTC)

@Mahagaja: Thanks for the report. Fixed, I think. — Eru·tuon 23:35, 15 December 2019 (UTC)

Error at ἀληθής

@Erutuon: at ἀληθής (alēthḗs), and presumably other -ης/-ες adjectives as well, in the Epic declension the neuter singular accusative is showing up as ᾰ̓ληθέᾰ (alēthéa) (the masculine/feminine accusative singular) instead of ᾰ̓ληθές (alēthés). —Mahāgaja · talk 20:29, 17 February 2020 (UTC)

@Mahagaja: Thanks for the report. Fixed. (Seems like we need a lot more testcases, but they're kind of painful to add.) — Eru·tuon 18:46, 19 February 2020 (UTC)

Mycenaean & Linear B

Should Linear B declension forms be added to this Template or as a separate template? TheLateDentarthurdent (talk) 20:06, 7 May 2020 (UTC)

It should be a separate module, because Mycenaean Greek is treated as a separate language from Ancient Greek. —Mahāgaja · talk 07:52, 8 May 2020 (UTC)

Adjectives of υ-stems with two genders

Discussion moved from Appendix talk:Ancient Greek adjective declension tables#Adjectives of υ-stems with two genders.

Sorry if this is a stupid question, but how can I code an inflection table for ῥοδόπαχυς? According to LSJ, it has a masculine+feminine form ῥοδόπᾱχῠς and a neuter form ῥοδόπᾱχῠ, the genitive is ῥοδοπᾱ́χῠος. Bailly lists something that looks like an Ionic form ῥοδόπηχῠς with neuter ῥοδόπηχῠ and genitive ῥοδοπήχεος.

Documentation says two-gendered adjectives of the third declension should be specified by stem only. But none of ῥοδόπᾱχῠ, ῥοδόπᾱχυ, ῥοδόπᾱχεϝ works as a single parameter to grc-adecl (“Stem does not end in a consonant”).

Πολύτροπος (talk) 03:58, 8 August 2022 (UTC)

@Πολύτροπος: Adjectives with a masculine and neuter genitive singular in -ῠος aren't supported by the module. The corresponding nominal declension exists, but hasn't been made available to adjectives. Nor I think are masculine-and-neuter-only adjectives supported, so you have to put in the feminine. I'm not sure where LSJ gets -ῠος from either. Maybe it's just inferred and Bailly infers something different. If you want, you can manually set the forms with |MGS=...ῠος|NGS=...ῠος. — Eru·tuon 23:12, 8 August 2022 (UTC)

Awkward column widths

Some of the inflectional tables, for example at ὁ, have a grossly oversized initial column and are almost running off the edge of my screen even at 90% zoom, forcing the final elements to be awkwardly compressed. It seems to me that this first column in particular (containing Number, Case/Gender, etc.) could comfortably be specified at half or even one third of its current width. Also contributing to this problem is the variant width of the following columns—which I can only assume is set based on the respective widths of the headings Masculine, Feminine, Neuter. Even taken in isolation this sizing is IMO visually unsatisfactory, especially when we consider the fact that the length of each form is fairly uniform (at least within each given number) across the table. Perhaps we could consider a more balanced sizing? Helrasincke (talk) 11:46, 8 August 2023 (UTC)

Bug in accentuation

According to Smyth 163a, in Ionic feminine plural genitives, the usual rule restricting the accent is relaxed. So for example, we should have θαλάσσεων rather than θαλασσέων. The Lua code outputs θαλασσέων.--Valvecable (talk) 17:47, 26 December 2023 (UTC)