User talk:O ec

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Enjoy your stay at Wiktionary! Ultimateria (talk) 22:31, 10 March 2012 (UTC)

Munique (capital) has no gender in Portuguese

Hi,

"Munique (capital) has no gender in Portuguese"

Are you sure about this? --Anatoli ^{(обсудить}/^вклад) 07:33, 27 September 2012 (UTC)

Yes. --O ec (talk) 07:43, 27 September 2012 (UTC)

Can you provide a source for your claim? Well, Porto is a masculine and Lisboa is a feminine. Proper nouns have genders in Portuguese, sometimes mixed (both masculine and feminine), even if they don't use articles. The collocations "velho Munique" and "velha Munique" tell me that "Munique" in Portuguese can be both masculine and feminine. --Anatoli ^{(обсудить}/^вклад) 07:56, 27 September 2012 (UTC)

I'm a native speaker, anyway read this [1], some cities like Munique has no gender, we don't use an a or o pronoun article with them never. Can I keep the change? --O ec (talk) 08:05, 27 September 2012 (UTC)

Thanks for the reply. This is a contentious issue and I don't trust this source very much. Some people call "genderless", when both genders can be applied. I have to go away now but I will raise this question for a broader discussion. Will let you know. If you're right, we'll need to document it somewhere. --Anatoli ^{(обсудить}/^вклад) 08:10, 27 September 2012 (UTC)

The phrase "A velha Munique" has an ellipsis on it, it is an elliptical form of "A velha cidade de Munique", the segment "cidade de" are implicit there, even in locution as "A Munique", the "cidade de" segment are implicit there too, they are shortening, not article+noun simply, it to me sounds as always having an omittion happening. If you have to care about something that would be my english.--O ec (talk) 08:28, 27 September 2012 (UTC)

It isn't suitable to say things like Estou na Munique, Vou na Munique, Moro na Munique without it be contextualized before into text (I myselft never heard it being used that way), cause make no sense; it is said when refering to city: Estou em Munique (genderless), Vou a Munique (genderless), Moro em Munique (genderless).

--O ec (talk) 10:43, 27 September 2012 (UTC)

As ellipsis occurs both the article a and any adjective remain(s) on ellipsed form but that are direct linked to city of (cidade de) segment mainly, not to Munique compound word itself, then to me Munique per se is genderless out of that locution, and any text where the same omittion equally happens.

--O ec (talk) 11:06, 27 September 2012 (UTC)

I didn't know you were a native speaker. Please add {{Babel}}, so that people know what languages you speak. I still have doubts. I have created Munique. Please continue on Wiktionary:Tea_room#Munique. --Anatoli ^{(обсудить}/^вклад) 11:42, 27 September 2012 (UTC)

Oh, thanks to invite me, however I will decline, sorry, I'm not proficient in english, so I prefer not to step in on that hostile territory, and babel box is so ugly >.<, so anything you decide I will have to accept anyway! But to me will stay genderless not matter what entry will say, I will know it, what is the most important given the situation :P

--O ec (talk) 11:59, 27 September 2012 (UTC)