Talk:yêu

Etymology

@Fumiko Take Hey mate, I'm wondering whether you could dig further on the etymology of this word (or know of any resources for finding out equivalent words of this in Vietnamese dialects or other Vietic languages)? Thanks! Wyang (talk) 11:13, 16 May 2016 (UTC)

It's supposed to be "Sinitic Vietnamese," from 愛 (I guess originally Sino-Vietnamese, but eventually with its phonetics modified). 204.11.189.94 12:15, 16 May 2016 (UTC)

From ái to yêu? That's highly unlikely. I don't think there's any plausible way in which /j/ turned into /w/, <zero> turned into /i/, "sắc" into "ngang". If anything, it's more likely to derive from 妖 (yêu). But that's just my speculation. ばかFumiko￥^talk 12:58, 16 May 2016 (UTC)

Thanks for the reply. I couldn't think of any plausible Sino-Vietnamese origin for this either. ái seems unlikely. Wyang (talk) 05:27, 17 May 2016 (UTC)

It's not my opinion; it's what it said in the sources I looked at. 204.11.189.94 15:33, 16 May 2016 (UTC)

The chu Nom appears to be 𢞅. 173.89.236.187 05:01, 17 May 2016 (UTC)

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The Starling Database has the following commentary on 夭:

Used also in the binome 夭紹 *ʔaw-dawʔ 'beautiful'. Also read *ʔawʔ, MC ʔéw(FQ 於兆), Pek. yǎo 'to kill prematurely'. Since Late Zhou the meaning 'be beautiful; consider beautiful, love' was usually written by the character 妖. The latter also means 'ghostly, supernatural': whether it is just a semantic development of the original meaning or an independent word is not quite clear.

Since Late Zhou the character is also attested with a reading *ʔāwʔ, MC ʔấw (FQ 烏皓), Pek. ǎo 'young, young age' (possibly related to *ʔawʔ 'kill prematurely' = 'kill in a young age').

If we can find the passages of 夭/妖 meaning “to consider beautiful; to love”, the 夭/妖 etymology would be very likely. Wyang (talk) 05:47, 17 April 2018 (UTC)

Hmm. Hanyu Da Cidian on 夭桃:

1. 《詩•周南•桃夭》：「桃之夭夭，灼灼其華。」後以「夭桃」稱艷麗的桃花 (beautiful peach blossom)。

   宋·曾鞏《南湖行》之二：「蒲芽荇蔓自相依，躑躅夭桃開滿枝。」

   清·曹寅《三月六日登鼓樓看花》詩：「東風澹蕩搖晴煙，城西夭桃紅欲然。」

   許地山《你為什麼不來》：「在夭桃開透，濃蔭欲成的時候，誰不想伴着他心愛的人出去游逛游逛呢？」

2. 喻少女容顏美麗 (beautiful, of a girl)。

   《敦煌變文集•維摩詰經菩薩品》：「夭桃而乃越姮娥，艷質而休誇妲妃。」

   唐·崔玨《有贈》詩之二：「兩臉夭桃從鏡發，一眸春水照人寒。」

   《京本通俗小說•西山一窟鬼》：「朱唇綴一顆夭桃，皓齒排兩行碎玉。」

   清·汪懋麟《送樹百給事使閩》詩：「吳越富好女，雙頰燃夭桃。」

3. 《詩•周南•桃夭》詩中有「之子于歸，宜其室家」之句，後以「詠《夭桃》」表示求偶之意 (to chant 夭桃 = to find a husband or wife; to seek a mate)。

   明·王錂《春蕪記•訴怨》：「若使俺有機會呵，直待要詠《夭桃》誦《摽梅》。」

   明·梅鼎祚《玉合記•懷春》：「詠《夭桃》雖則有時，歎‘匏瓜’終當無匹。」

on 桃夭:

1. 《詩•周南》有《桃夭》篇，贊美男女婚姻以時，室家之好。後因以指婚嫁 (loving marriage; marriage in general)。

   漢·阮瑀《止欲賦》：「思桃夭之所宜，願無衣之同裳。」

   唐·白居易《得乙女將嫁於丁既納幣而乙悔丁訴之乙云未立婚書判》：「請從玉潤之訴，無過桃夭之時。」

   元·鄭光祖《倩女離魂》楔子：「只為禹門浪煖催人去，因此匆匆未敢問桃夭。」

   清·李漁《玉搔頭•訊玉》：「我只怕盼于歸，負卻桃夭。」

Vietnamese yêu đào (Từ điển tiếng Việt, Viện Ngôn ngữ học):

1. (Từ cũ, Văn chương) cây đào non mới nở hoa; dùng để ví người con gái đẹp (new peach blossom; beautiful girl)

   "Vẻ chi một đoá yêu đào, Vườn hồng chi dám ngăn rào chim xanh." (TKiều)

There is also đào yêu (“marriageable/nubile girl”). Từ điển trích dẫn, Từ điển Thiều Chửu:

“Đào yêu” 桃夭 là một bài trong “Thi Kinh” 詩經, nói việc hôn nhân chính đáng, nay ta gọi con gái đi lấy chồng là “đào yêu” 桃夭 là vì đó. ... “Di Tử Hà” 彌子瑕 ăn đào thấy ngon để dành dâng vua “Vệ” 衛, vì thế vua yêu, nay gọi kẻ đàn ông được ai yêu là “dư đào” 餘桃 là bởi cớ đó.

Nguyễn Tuấn Cường (2006), “Tiếp nhận Kinh Thi tại Việt Nam thời trung đại: Từ góc nhìn phiên dịch Hán Nôm”. Hội thảo khoa học Quốc tế: Văn học Việt Nam trong bối cảnh giao lưu văn hóa khu vực và quốc tế do Viện Nghiên cứu Văn học (Việt Nam) và Viện Harvard-Yenching (Mĩ) tổ chức:

Phiếu hữu mai 摽有梅 (Hán văn 12 câu, dịch 5 câu tr. 45a)
Quả mai rụng bảy rụng ba,
Cầu ta thứ sĩ hẳn là kịp nay.
Rổ nghiêng lại lấy hết đây,
Hôn nhân chẳng được như ngày “đào yêu”.
- Vốn từ lí hạng ca dao.

Was this a word that evolved from the literary culture? Wyang (talk) 06:50, 17 April 2018 (UTC)

Is it possible that yêu evolved from 要 (necessary, essential; necessity). Vien.Vu1 (talk) 03:12, 31 October 2022 (UTC)

@Vien.Vu1 Quite possible. 要 did and still does function as a verb with the meanings "to want, to need" (among many). "To want, to need" do semantically overlap with and can semantically evolve into "to have a strong affection for, to love".

• According to Nôm Foundation, the Vietnamese verb yêu ("to have a strong affection for, to love") was transcribed with the Nôm character 要 in Lạc An cư sĩ (樂安居士 "Serenely Contented Hermit")'s "Sô Nghiêu đối thoại (芻蕘對話 "Dialogue between the Grassmower and Firewood-Gatherer") (folio 10a): Giúp nạn, chống dịch, cùng nương cậy. Biết kính, hay yêu, lẫn thuận hoà. "Help [victims of] disasters, fight epidemics, rely on each other! Be mindfully respectful, love often, be harmonious together!"

Even so, as a verb 要 (MC 'jiewH) had the departing-tone in Middle Chinese, which evolved into Sino-Vietnamese sắc tone of Sino-Vietnamese reflex yếu (as in thiết yếu "essential"). Generally, the Qieyun system's C tone (去聲) evolved into Vietnamese B tones (sắc-nặng) in Sino-Vietnamese words; even though there are exceptions to this rule: e.g. đôi (ngang-tone) < Proto-Vietic *toːj, a non-Sino-Vietnamese reading of Chinese 對 (“pair, double”, SV: đối) (for the tonal correspondence between "non(early? dialectal?)"-Sino-Vietnamese A tones (ngang-huyền) and QYS's C tone (去聲), Alves (2018)), I know not if this were among those exceptions.

As said above, IF one can find a passage where 夭/妖 definitely means "to consider beautiful; to love", then Vietnamese yêu is likely from 夭/妖. Erminwin (talk) 21:49, 21 December 2022 (UTC)