Talk:阿Q

Deletion debate

The following information passed a request for deletion.

This discussion is no longer live and is left here as an archive. Please do not modify this conversation, but feel free to discuss its conclusions.

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阿Q

Tagged but not listed. -- Prince Kassad 18:46, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

• Strong keep. This is a word found in many dictionaries. Tell me how you can decipher its meaning based on 阿 and Q? I can't even believe this has been nominated for deletion. ---> Tooironic 09:08, 23 March 2011 (UTC)
  • Well, I'd move it to RfV actually. It looks like this needs some citations (which I cannot find readily). -- Prince Kassad 09:38, 23 March 2011 (UTC)
    • I definitely don't speak Mandarin, but as an outsider, Tooironic's analysis looks absolutely correct. --Mglovesfun (talk) 17:14, 23 March 2011 (UTC)

Strong keep. --Anatoli 23:16, 23 March 2011 (UTC)

Keep of course. I agree with Mg's point above. I thought this was some sort of product name, in which case I probably would have said delete, but it's not so I won't. 50 Xylophone Players talk 23:59, 23 March 2011 (UTC)

Kept. DAVilla 15:20, 29 March 2011 (UTC)

Pronunciation

Is the "Q" supposed to be pronounced as "kiùr" or "guì?"  WikiWinters ☯ 韦安智  01:26, 8 December 2015 (UTC)

@Suzukaze-c Any idea?  WikiWinters ☯ 韦安智  01:27, 8 December 2015 (UTC)

I haven't the faintest idea. The IPA says something along the lines of kiour4 , although this sounds incredibly bizarre to me (I would expect something like "kiu1", but maybe that's because of my exposure to Cantonese). @Atitarev? —suzukaze (t・c) 04:13, 8 December 2015 (UTC)

Must be [kʰy], pinyin substitute for which is "kyu" (or "kyù" for the 4th tone), just like in 三Q, made by User:Wyang. --Anatoli T. ^{(обсудить}/^вклад) 04:22, 8 December 2015 (UTC)

(Before E/C) The combination "yu" after letters such as "k" must be the same as "ü" in the standard pinyin but "ü" is harder to enter and there is no "kü" combination in Mandarin pinyin, so "kyu" works fine as well. --Anatoli T. ^{(обсудить}/^вклад) 04:37, 8 December 2015 (UTC)

I'd reckon it's "kiù," not "kyù," but, regardless, how do you know? Read this (it explains the "Q" part).  WikiWinters ☯ 韦安智  04:30, 8 December 2015 (UTC)

(After E/C) I can't be 100% sure but I think this is how it's pronounced today by Mandarin speakers. It's the closest approximation of the English letter Q and this is how Q is pronounced in 三Q, which I heard pronounced. it's one of the ways and other pronunciations will depend on speakers abilities and knowledge. BTW, 派對／派对 (pàiduì, “party”) is often pronounced just like the English "party", especially in Taiwan and Honkong but /pʰaɪ̯⁵¹⁻⁵³ tu̯eɪ̯⁵¹/ is the standard pronunciation. --Anatoli T. ^{(обсудить}/^вклад) 04:37, 8 December 2015 (UTC)

@Atitarev, WikiWinters, Suzukaze-c: This article may shed some light on the pronunciation. It has qiū, kiū and guì as options, favouring the first two. — justin(r)leung _{{ (t...) | c=› }} 07:42, 8 December 2015 (UTC)

I've added some more pronunciations, if they are referenced, I guess, we can add them. --Anatoli T. ^{(обсудить}/^вклад) 12:14, 8 December 2015 (UTC)

What about for 三Q?  WikiWinters ☯ 韦安智  15:00, 8 December 2015 (UTC)

@WikiWinters For 三Q, qiū and kiū might work, but guì definitely doesn't work, since it's only specific to 阿Q, being 阿桂 or 阿貴.

@Atitarev You essentially added pseudo-pinyin to 三Q. Does it rhyme with jiù? If so, I don't see why it shouldn't be kiù, even if that's spelled the same as the Cantonese romanization. What actual word in pinyin does kyù rhyme with? Is it supposed to be k (like 口) + y (like 又) + u (like 不)?  WikiWinters ☯ 韦安智  21:54, 8 December 2015 (UTC)

@WikiWinters It rhymes with "nǜ", yes, "k" as in "口". You should be able to read the generated IPA, which is the important part here [kʰy⁵¹] = "kǜ" where [kʰ] = "k", [y] = "ü", [... ⁵¹] is the marker for the fourth tone. "kǜ" is not a valid pinyin in standard Chinese but this is how it can be described using the usual notation. --Anatoli T. ^{(обсудить}/^вклад) 22:14, 8 December 2015 (UTC)

@WikiWinters, Atitarev It think it's better to use "kǜ" instead of "kyù", even if it's harder to type, since it follows the pattern of nǜ and lǜ (to distinguish from nù and lù) and y is only used when there isn't a consonant in front of i or ü. — justin(r)leung _{{ (t...) | c=› }} 22:20, 8 December 2015 (UTC)

Done, I didn't know if "kǜ" would work and give the desired result. --Anatoli T. ^{(обсудить}/^вклад) 22:24, 8 December 2015 (UTC)