Reconstruction talk:Proto-Slavic/borti
Add topicSomeone has put *barati as a related term, probably based on ЭССЯ, Vol. 1. I agree that the alleged Slovak bárat' (“to hit”), Old East Slavic барати (barati, “to fight”) appear to be related to *borti, however, the South Slavic Bulgarian барам (baram, “to handle, to examine”), Macedonian бара (bara, “to look for”), Slovene barati (“to inquire”) are more likely to be derivatives of *bьrati (“to pick up”) (e.g. suggested by Младенов). One possible explanation is that they were formed as an intensive variant of the ancestor of Bulgarian боравя (boravja, “to employ”) from the O-grade of *bьrati (cf. разбор (razbor, “analisys”), подбор (podbor, “selection”), прибор (pribor, “tool, utensil”)). Unfortunately, the Bulgarian Etymological Dictionary also derives барам from *borti, likely following ЭССЯ, so I can't provide more insights of the Младенов's proposal.
Just as a sidenote, one intensive derivative of proto-Slavic *borti in Bulgarian is e.g. събарям (sǎbarjam, “to demolish, to knock down”) /perf/ < съборя (sǎborja, “to wrestle”) /impf/, which points towards *bar(j)ěti, not *barati. Bezimenen (talk) 13:19, 7 January 2019 (UTC)
neoacute
[edit]@Rua, I'm not sure that there could be an accent paradigm (b) in this form. Gnosandes (talk) 16:50, 3 February 2020 (UTC)
- @Gnosandes: The Balto-Slavic forms continue ye-present, which erases the PIE laryngeal (by Pinault's law). AP b is to be expected. 5.150.99.73 16:54, 3 February 2020 (UTC)
- And even if the present had been the simple thematic type, the laryngeal would not have been in the syllable coda and it would just have been dropped. This is the case with *tèrti. See also w:Proto-Slavic#AP b verbs. —Rua (mew) 17:04, 3 February 2020 (UTC)
- See alo Proto-Slavic *kòlti - virtually the same situation as Proto-Slavic *borti. 5.150.99.73 17:18, 3 February 2020 (UTC)
- @Rua: @5.150.99.73:, Thanks for the discussion. I was wrong, but you're good. I was very much confused, perhaps, by the Kortlandt theory. Can also add this form tȁrem ~ trȅm (Juraj Križanić). Gnosandes (talk) 14:33, 4 February 2020 (UTC)
- See alo Proto-Slavic *kòlti - virtually the same situation as Proto-Slavic *borti. 5.150.99.73 17:18, 3 February 2020 (UTC)
- And even if the present had been the simple thematic type, the laryngeal would not have been in the syllable coda and it would just have been dropped. This is the case with *tèrti. See also w:Proto-Slavic#AP b verbs. —Rua (mew) 17:04, 3 February 2020 (UTC)