User talk:Ppcosta

I am your friend

Hi, I think you are so cute and cool. I admire your work in West Frisian, maybe we should go to Tindia some time. (Salominha (talk))

IPA stress mark

Hi, thanks for adding pronunciation info to West Frisian entries. Please be sure to use the IPA stress mark ˈ rather than a normal apostrophe to mark stress. Thanks! —Mahāgaja · talk 14:25, 19 February 2019 (UTC)

Also, pronunciation lines start with an asterisk in wiki-markup (rendering as a bullet on screen), thus:

* {{IPA|/ˈvɔ.lə/|lang=fy}}

—Mahāgaja · talk 14:27, 19 February 2019 (UTC)

One more thing: please use the IPA symbol ɡ rather than the normal g. They may look alike in some fonts, but in others they look different, and the software always knows! —Mahāgaja · talk 14:38, 19 February 2019 (UTC)

Thank you for clarifying, I'm still somewhat new to Wiktionary conventions and such Ppcosta (talk) 16:52, 19 February 2019 (UTC)

Accelerated form creation for West Frisian

Hi, I saw you working on these. I made some changes, so you can now automatically create plurals as well as diminutives. I also created {{fy-noun-dim}} (parallel to {{nl-noun-dim}}) for diminutive nouns. I hope it works as it should, please try it out! —Rua (mew) 18:57, 21 March 2019 (UTC)

Thank you so much! I'm still somewhat new to Lua and everything, so this helps a lot! Ppcosta (talk) 21:49, 21 March 2019 (UTC)

Frisian pronouns

Hi, I wondered why you went around and changed all these after I fixed them all up yesterday? Now I have to change them back again. —Rua (mew) 11:50, 22 March 2019 (UTC)

Please see my message on your talk page. Ppcosta (talk) 15:03, 22 March 2019 (UTC)

Errors

Hi, I noticed that some of the entries you created contained mistakes. For example, you entered the diminutive of tsjerkhôf as tsjerkhôvke while the correct form is tsjerkhôfke. The plural of begraafplak was entered as begraafplaken, but it should be begraafplakken. Are you sure you know West Frisian well enough to be creating entries for it? —Rua (mew) 12:34, 22 March 2019 (UTC)

To be honest, I think it's more likely that I made a typo or that I found an incorrect source since I get most of my information from the Fryske Akademy's dictionary portal. I don't consider myself proficient enough in West Frisian to add terms without reference, so I think it's unlikely that I added those entries off of anything but a typo or a messed up source. Thank you for checking in. Ppcosta (talk) 14:28, 22 March 2019 (UTC)

Inflection of adjectives

Inflections of West Frisian adjectives are better handled with an inflection table like the one used for Dutch. Using "inflected form" as a definition is discouraged and we're trying to move away from it. See the recent discussions on WT:RFDO. —Rua (mew) 19:38, 23 March 2019 (UTC)

Thank you for clarifying Ppcosta (talk) 20:03, 23 March 2019 (UTC)

I've created a table for adjective inflections, based on the Dutch one. See fyn and hurd. Note that because the inflections are now shown in their own section, the template {{fy-adj}} (which shows the inflected form) is no longer needed. Using it would only end up showing the same form twice and requiring the editor to specify it twice. The new template currently does not include the special forms used when the following noun is missing, but I intend to do those sometime in the future. —Rua (mew) 21:16, 23 March 2019 (UTC)

Thank you! —Ppcosta (talk) 22:21, 24 March 2019 (UTC)

Appendix:West Frisian pronunciation

I wrote this as a guide for how pronunciations should be written on Wiktionary. It's mostly based on the Wikipedia article, which I edited to include a few cases that were not covered before. I hope it's helpful to you. —Rua (mew) 13:28, 18 April 2019 (UTC)

Thank you, looks great, I just have a couple concerns. The diphthong ai is transcribed as /ai̯/, while the sources I've seen describe it as /aɪ̯/. Second, I think a section on vowels with diacritics would be useful. I would write one, but I'm on my phone right now and won't have access to a computer for a couple more days. Last, I think the dialect format is a bit confusing, as the names "Clay" and "Wood" don't refer to locations, but dialects. I think the Frisian names for them work better as markers. Of course, you're more familiar with conventions here, so the decision is up to you, that's just my take on it. Ppcosta (talk) 20:15, 19 April 2019 (UTC)

Wikipedia has Clay Frisian and Wood Frisian, so it made sense to me to do the same here. Using the native names is less accessible to an English speaker, who is the target audience of the English Wiktionary.

Regarding /ai̯/, that's just a minor phonetic difference, not relevant to the overall phonemic transcription. Of course, phonetic transcriptions can be added in [ ] brackets after the phonemic one, but that's likely to be a very dialect-specific affair. Phonemes, by definition, express contrasts and phonological features. Whether the final sound of a diphthong is fully close or near-close is totally irrelevant to that if there's no contrast. —Rua (mew) 17:05, 20 April 2019 (UTC)

Alright. Thank you very much. Ppcosta (talk) 17:08, 20 April 2019 (UTC)

After some further research, it appears that [ɡ] and [ɣ] are not entirely allophones, since there is a morphological component as well. hartoginne preserves the fricative of hartoch despite being stressed, while needgefal preserves the plosive of gefal despite being unstressed and no longer word-initial. It therefore appears that the allophony only applies within single words, but gets broken when affixes or compounds are involved. I therefore think it's better to indicate these as separate phonemes after all, since otherwise there would be no way to predict the correct pronunciation from the phonemic transcription. —Rua (mew) 00:12, 6 May 2019 (UTC)

Pronunciation of sûchdier

Hey, thanks for taking the time to add West Frisian pronunciations. But the transcription at sûchdier has a few details that puzzle me. <ch> representing /ɡ/ rather than /x/ seems unlikely to me, even with regressive assimilation I would expect the realisation [ɣ] rather than any stop. Also, stress on the last element is also unusual for a rather straightforward compound noun. (Note that until about 15 years ago apostrophes in Dutch dictionary headwords indicated that the syllable before the apostrophe was stressed.) ←₰-→ Lingo ^Bingo _Dingo (talk) 08:50, 10 July 2019 (UTC)

You're correct about the stress, not sure why I put it the way I did. The realization of <ch> as /g/ seemed strange to me when I found a pronunciation entry for it (the Wurdboek fan de Fryske Taal, which I would usually use, doesn't have a transcription for sûchdier), but the official Fryske Akademy dictionary on taalweb.frl lists it as such. Perhaps it occurs as that because of the root sûge that the word comes from? Ppcosta (talk) 03:17, 11 July 2019 (UTC)

The pronunciation key in the print edition indicates that, rather confusingly, they use the double-story Roman <g> for [ɣ] and the single-story <g> for [ɡ], so sûchdier has a [ɣ] which is /x/ phonemically. Apparently they didn't like using the gamma. ←₰-→ Lingo ^Bingo _Dingo (talk) 08:23, 11 July 2019 (UTC)

Terrific. Thank you for following up. Ppcosta (talk) 23:57, 11 July 2019 (UTC)

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Sincerely,

RMaung (WMF) 14:31, 9 September 2019 (UTC)

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Sincerely,

RMaung (WMF) 19:12, 20 September 2019 (UTC)

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Sincerely,

RMaung (WMF) 17:02, 4 October 2019 (UTC)