Talk:minister

Government ministers - what are they?

Is minister really someone who "heads a ministry"? Maybe it applies to some countries. The definition was changed from "A person who is commissioned by the government for public service" in diff in 2010 from Wikipedia. Was the change correct? What is the best definition?

What follows is some material researching the questions.

In the U.K., there are junior ministers, ministers of state and cabinet ministers.[1] As a source says, "The most junior Ministers are Parliamentary Under Secretaries of State, of whom there will be one in a small department and three or four in a large department."[2] That does not sound like the three or four head any department. Another page lists e.g. Ben Wallace MP, The Rt Hon James Heappey MP, The Rt Hon Alec Shelbrooke MP,Baroness Goldie DL and Sarah Atherton MP as part of Ministry of Defence; that does not sound like they are all heads of a ministry.[3] This matches W:List_of_government_ministers_of_the_United_Kingdom, which lists multiple minister roles per department, e.g. per Ministry of Justice or per Ministry of Defence. A chart shows there are over 70 junior ministers in the U.K.[4]. "The total number of ministers in government posts in December 2019, following the general election and reshuffle of Boris Johnson’s Government, was 116."[5]

In the U.S., a similar role to cabinet ministers seems to be of "secretaries" and these do not seem to be called "ministers".

Ministers on non-sovereign level:

• In Scotland, "Cabinet Secretaries are supported by Ministers."[6] That sounds like the secretaries are the heads and ministers merely support them.
• Northern Ireland has ministers[7].
• Ontario has ministers[8].
• Alberta has ministers[9].
• Bavaria has ministers[10].

Wikipedia:List of agriculture ministries reveals which countries have the role called "minister". Great many countries have such roles, but U.S. is not one of them. In Australia, the person is called "minister" but the department is called "department", not "ministry".

“minister”, in OneLook Dictionary Search. and minister in Britannica Dictionary online do not use the language of "head of ministry". Nonetheless, they often use the language of "head of department". However, Cambridge allows "or has an important position in it."[11]

Do junior ministers in the U.K. each head a department (perhaps a subdepartment) or do they merely "have an important position in it"? And if they do head a department, is the department a "ministry"?

--Dan Polansky (talk) 17:19, 19 October 2022 (UTC)

In the British political context the term minister includes the Prime Minister (or first minister in the devolved governments) plus anyone appointed by her/him to exercise executive responsibility within a government department or someone appointed to equivalent rank without attachment to a department (i.e. minister without portfolio). It is therefore not restricted to those who head a ministry/department. Voltaigne (talk) 14:07, 20 October 2022 (UTC)