Talk:J-shaped

RFD discussion: September–November 2017

See Talk:H-shaped#RFD discussion: September–November 2017.

RFD discussion: March–June 2018

The following discussion has been moved from Wiktionary:Requests for deletion (permalink).

This discussion is no longer live and is left here as an archive. Please do not modify this conversation, but feel free to discuss its conclusions.

---

J-shaped

Tagged but not listed. Note that we decided to keep other similar entries. John Cross (talk) 00:02, 22 March 2018 (UTC)

• @SemperBlotto RFD-tagged it when he created the entry. I wonder whether it was a slip-up. DonnanZ (talk) 00:35, 22 March 2018 (UTC)
• I was probably stoned at the time. Keep all. SemperBlotto (talk) 06:09, 22 March 2018 (UTC)

It is silly to delete them one by one when we have a full set and some kind of existing consensus. OTOH I feel there is something blatantly SoP about these: if I said "ᓴ-shaped", you might not know what ᓴ is but you can tell what it means because the shape is literally in front of your eyes. Equinox ◑ 06:13, 22 March 2018 (UTC)

I will start by conceding that these do follow a predictable pattern. If you emailed me about a"ᓴ-shaped" walking stick, I would know what you meant. Without prior knowledge:

• I would not be able to distinguish between h-shaped and H-shaped.
• I would not know that F-shaped could mean shaped like the mirror image of an "F".
• I certainly would not know about the sense of U-shaped where the "U" is a broad-based "U".

Note also that Duden has L-förmig, S-förmig and X-förmig.

John Cross (talk) 06:54, 22 March 2018 (UTC)

I don't think I'm gonna vote against these, but to be fair "I would not know that F can be mirror-F" is a pathetic argument. That's like saying you can't recognise a triangular thing as a triangle if I turn it upside-down. It is understood by us, as beings in a 3D world, that shapes can be rotated. Equinox ◑ 07:04, 22 March 2018 (UTC)

I am pleased that you are not planning to vote against these. You obviously don't have to agree with me but I would not want anyone to think I was making poor arguments at least not deliberately or due to a unreasonable lack of care. I take your point that many objects can be rotated in the 3D world. I was coming at this from a different perspective. I was really trying to say that it would not have occurred to me to add the mirror-image point to the definitions had someone else not done so (it may be incorrect but if it is correct then it is important to the definition). Sometimes we impose the language of the 2D world on the 3D world when we say for example we might talk about a square-based prism, a triangular work surface or a circular stain. It turns out that some poles have a G-shaped base.[1] You could break the base off and flip it but then it would not be a base. You could dig up an F-shaped flower bed and change it to be another shape but it is not a trivial task. John Cross (talk) 01:27, 23 March 2018 (UTC)

Note that I have made a list of other dictionaries that have entries for terms of the form *-shaped. John Cross (talk) 08:26, 25 March 2018 (UTC)

• Keep all John Cross (talk) 06:55, 22 March 2018 (UTC)
• Yep, keep all. DonnanZ (talk) 09:58, 22 March 2018 (UTC)
• Delete as SOP. It looks like this is absent from most if not all other general dictionaries written in English. ←₰-→ Lingo ^Bingo _Dingo (talk) 13:46, 23 March 2018 (UTC)
• Keep J-shaped per Talk:H-shaped#RFD discussion: September–November 2017. Dictionaries: User:John Cross/letter-shaped; for some reason, only OED has J-shaped. --Dan Polansky (talk) 09:22, 31 March 2018 (UTC)

K-shaped

Tagged but not listed. Note that we decided to keep other similar entries. John Cross (talk) 00:03, 22 March 2018 (UTC)

• The same (as J-shaped) happened here. DonnanZ (talk) 00:37, 22 March 2018 (UTC)
• Delete. ←₰-→ Lingo ^Bingo _Dingo (talk) 13:46, 23 March 2018 (UTC)
• Delete all such cases where the meaning is no more than "shaped like the thing mentioned". Virtually anything with any kind of recognisable shape can be used in this pattern: bowl-shaped, horseshoe-shaped, bottle-shaped, pumpkin-shaped ... the list is virtually endless. Mihia (talk) 22:04, 25 March 2018 (UTC)

We do have heart-shaped, bell-shaped, mushroom-shaped, egg-shaped etc John Cross (talk) 19:25, 29 March 2018 (UTC)

The FreeDictionary.com has pumpkin-shaped[2] and bowl-shaped[3] and bottle-shaped. I could not find horseshoe-shaped in an online dictionary. John Cross (talk) 17:05, 2 April 2018 (UTC)

"egg-shaped: Having the shape of an egg" pretty much makes my point for me. To the extent (which may be debated) that the others contain additional content beyond "shaped like the thing mentioned", they do not fall into my category. Mihia (talk) 00:28, 9 April 2018 (UTC)

Whatever there is that's specific to a given letter and not predictable should be covered in the entry for the letter. After all, it's a simple matter to substitute "that's in the shape of a k" or "that has the form of a k" or "that looks like a k" or "that's reminiscent of a k", etc. Chuck Entz (talk) 02:13, 9 April 2018 (UTC)

If I understand your point correctly, I agree with you. If someone can come up with any worthwhile additional information for K-shaped beyond "Shaped like the letter 'K'" then it should be kept. Otherwise it should be deleted. (I do not count "or its mirror image" as "worthwhile".) Mihia (talk) 02:27, 9 April 2018 (UTC)

• Delete as per Mihia. --SanctMinimalicen (talk) 00:18, 26 March 2018 (UTC)
• Sigh, keep. I thought the voting for both was above. DonnanZ (talk) 08:58, 26 March 2018 (UTC)
• Keep all. It is interesting and useful to know what these sorts of adjectives are applied to in practice. For instance, J-shaped is often used to describe graphs or distributions; V-shaped and U-shaped are used to describe types of valley. This stuff is what dictionaries do – just looking at the terms and declaring that they are sum-of-parts is not very rigorous IMO. Ƿidsiþ 04:44, 27 March 2018 (UTC)
• Delete I suggest to make a snowclone entry for these instead. --Octahedron80 (talk) 04:57, 27 March 2018 (UTC)

  I don't think that's what a snowclone is. Snowclones are entire phrases. Equinox ◑ 04:59, 27 March 2018 (UTC)

  Perhaps to make …-shaped like Chinese entries? It will cover things other than A-Z. I also have …ไป…ไป and …ใด…หนึ่ง. Ellipses are also useful. --Octahedron80 (talk) 05:02, 27 March 2018 (UTC)

• Keep. John Cross (talk) 20:52, 28 March 2018 (UTC)
• Keep K-shaped per Talk:H-shaped#RFD discussion: September–November 2017. Dictionaries: User:John Cross/letter-shaped; for some reason, they do not have K-shaped. --Dan Polansky (talk) 09:20, 31 March 2018 (UTC)
• Abstain per Widsith (could potentially be interesting, but in their current state they're not). --Per utramque cavernam (talk) 11:40, 4 April 2018 (UTC)

No consensus as to both entries. There is a clear absence of consensus after extended discussion. bd2412 T 14:37, 19 June 2018 (UTC)

RFD discussion: January–February 2022

See Talk:H-shaped#RFD discussion: January–February 2022.