Talk:wine cave

RFD discussion: December 2019–June 2020

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This discussion is no longer live and is left here as an archive. Please do not modify this conversation, but feel free to discuss its conclusions.

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wine cave

DTLHS (talk) 17:00, 24 December 2019 (UTC)

I tend towards Keep for the following reason. Like an ice cellar is a place for storing ice brought in from elsewhere, and a wine vault is a place just for storing (and consuming) wine produced elsewhere, one might be tempted to think a wine cave is just a cave for wine storage, Bur a wine cave is typically constructed specifically for wine production; although this may involve storage, it is storage for the aging of wine as part of the production process. This is not obvious from the individual parts.  --Lambiam 00:06, 25 December 2019 (UTC)

cheese cave, beer cave and probably other products that are aged are similarly used. DTLHS (talk) 00:08, 25 December 2019 (UTC)

It reminds me of bierkeller. DonnanZ (talk) 00:42, 25 December 2019 (UTC)

• Keep - fried egg... I believe there are plenty of citations online, books and Scholar that can be used to improve and support the definition. There are several related words/idioms: wine cask, wine bar, wine cooler, wine rack, wine thief, winepress, wineskin, wine vault, man cave, ice cave, coal cellar, root cellar and salt cellar. TFSA (talk) 11:34, 25 December 2019 (UTC)

Delete cave #3 is "A storage cellar, especially for wine or cheese". Neither wine cave's "an underground wine cellar" nor wine cellar's "An underground place for storing wine at a constant temperature." expand on what the storage is for, which is encyclopedic. (I'd say the wine cellar's "at a constant temperature" is a bit encyclopedic; is it not a wine cellar if the temperature varies some?)--Prosfilaes (talk) 15:03, 25 December 2019 (UTC)

• The conditions of a wine cave must be more specific than those of a wine cellar, right? This means it is less SOP than wine cellar, which may be about any cellar in which wine is stored. It’s just that as a consumer one hears the former less often to believe it is idiomatic. Leaning to keep. Fay Freak (talk) 15:09, 25 December 2019 (UTC)
  • Not according to our definition, where a wine cave is an underground wine cellar, and a wine cellar is by definition underground, where a cellar is by definition underground. cellar also says "A wine collection, especially when stored in a cellar."--Prosfilaes (talk) 19:50, 25 December 2019 (UTC)
    • I didn’t look at the definition, understanding an underground structure designed in a certain fashion for wine business. Fay Freak (talk) 21:46, 25 December 2019 (UTC)
      • If needed, we can amend the definition, for example: # an underground location for the storage of wine OR "# a subterranean grotto for the storage of wine." However, the idiom "wine cave" is certainly notable and should be in Wiktionary. TFSA (talk) 09:55, 26 December 2019 (UTC)
        • Notability is not a relevant criterion for this discussion. DTLHS (talk) 17:22, 26 December 2019 (UTC)
• Delete per Prosfilaes. * Pppery * _{it has begun...} 23:02, 26 December 2019 (UTC)
• <humor> Redirect to Pete Buttigieg </humor> Purplebackpack89 21:23, 27 December 2019 (UTC)

I find it hard to believe that there is any place that is a wine cave but isn't a cave. Equinox ◑ 04:57, 1 January 2020 (UTC)

• Weak keep on the understanding that this is a set term with specific meaning in the wine production industry, and is not just ad hoc for any cave in which wine might happen to be present. Mihia (talk) 20:37, 2 January 2020 (UTC)
• Weak delete per Prosfilaes; there are plenty of senses at cave that cover the artificial caves. ←₰-→ Lingo ^Bingo _Dingo (talk) 11:18, 7 January 2020 (UTC)

Kept: no consensus for deletion. PUC – 10:02, 29 June 2020 (UTC)