Talk:two pennies' worth

Usage notes

I'm a bit confused by the usage note: Two cents and two cents' worth have eclipsed the native two pennies' worth in England even though the cent is not a unit of currency there. Is there any proof of this as in my experience this is not the case? Little muddy funkster

What is clear and surprising is that the US-originated terms have gained some currency in the UK based on the limited usage of both terms I have seen in Google News (which allows search by country) and BNC. "Eclipsed" seems unwarranted, as both terms seem to be in use. It seems pretty clear that expressions using "tuppence" or even "two pence" seem to be falling into disuse. DCDuring TALK 17:33, 3 February 2010 (UTC)

I have only heard "two cents" used here in the figurative sense, i.e. for one's opinion. I'd be very surprised to hear it used for actual coins. Did your search take this into account? Should we modify the entry? Equinox ◑ 11:20, 11 September 2016 (UTC)

I haven't read anything to indicate that the older phrase is being superseded. I've only started searching recently.Halbared (talk) 18:31, 23 June 2020 (UTC)

I'm trying to find a reliable source for the claim that cents has overtaken pennies. At the moment I can only find dictionary versions of the English phrase, 'two pennyworth' and it's variants. The New Partridge Dictionary of Slang and Unconventional English for one, https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=mAdUqLrKw4YC&pg=PA2030&lpg=PA2030&dq=two+pennyworth+a+popular+saying+in+the+uk&source=bl&ots=t3T4cMlkxH&sig=ACfU3U0d0Q1_w10GsnFIzPGJFoZKtiKrJQ&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjm5t7mx5jqAhX8Q0EAHUxbDnoQ6AEwAnoECA0QAQ#v=onepage&q=two%20pennyworth%20a%20popular%20saying%20in%20the%20uk&f=false and this one with a related phrase. https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=LAKQCwAAQBAJ&pg=PA135&lpg=PA135&dq=two+ennyworth+a+popular+saying+in+the+uk&source=bl&ots=IRalyF-JEK&sig=ACfU3U1lQFr0ZF7Ha3z4hF3vI938k6pWdA&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwj39afcx5jqAhWNN8AKHTvkCJ8Q6AEwAHoECAsQAQ#v=onepage&q=two%20ennyworth%20a%20popular%20saying%20in%20the%20uk&f=false. Nothing on saying that two cents has overtaken. The above contributors have their own orgnal research saying this is the case, but something else is needed Halbared (talk) 18:29, 23 June 2020 (UTC)

@Halbared: Personal experience (always lived in Britain, born in 1980): I am fairly sure I didn't encounter either phrase (cents or pennies) until I got online in 1998-ish, and then of course on the US-dominated Internet/Usenet I saw "two cents" a lot, which is something people frequently say on forums and newsgroups. I still, to this day (I'm 40 now) haven't heard anyone call it "two pennies". Equinox ◑ 23:15, 23 June 2020 (UTC)

Likewise my own anecdotal evidence if the opposite. I've never heard the two cents in person, but have I heard two pennyworth/tuppence/pence/other (not pennies, that sounds like a US thing). It possibly may be an saying for older generations. If two cents has genuinely overtaken the older saying then having it in usage would be good, but without a source it looks anecdotal/original research.Halbared (talk) 08:40, 24 June 2020 (UTC)

I actually hadn't fully notice dthe page was 'two pennies', I would guess the creator was an American and wiki being Americancentric assumed that was the version used in the UK. https://www.oxfordlearnersdictionaries.com/definition/english/pennyworth. Twopennyworth seems to be the more accurate/larger version used. How would one get this page name changed?

A huge claim is made (which on the face of it has no basis) can stay so long as a request for a source for an indeterminate amount of time is there? What if no source can ever be found? The unsubstantiated claim can lie forever?Halbared (talk) 08:45, 24 June 2020 (UTC)

Don't panic. You already deleted it. I suppose the best way we can try to prove or disprove this is by some corpus searches. Good luck if you can find anyone who can be bothered. I would, BTW, be genuinely curious to see any evidence of people saying that they are putting their "two pennies" into a debate. Equinox ◑ 09:03, 24 June 2020 (UTC)

THank you for responding. The 'panic' made me smile, I suppose it could look that way. ;)I'm actually trying now to find out what can about the sayings on the web. I found this book, A Dictionary of Confusable Phrases: More Than 10,000 Idioms and Collocations By Yuri Dolgopolov, page 135, but nothing on how much it is used. I am genuinely interested too, I hear two-pennyworth, not regularly, but on and off.Halbared (talk) 09:06, 24 June 2020 (UTC)

Without taking any sides here I would like to point out that you are basically in a "revert war" now and it would be much better to engage with Wiktionary nerds on WT:TR or somewhere, and see who can find what evidence. If you just keep deleting stuff it probably won't end well. Good luck! Equinox ◑ 12:42, 24 June 2020 (UTC)

Thanks, your input has been helpful and welcoming, as opposed to didactic and robotic.Halbared (talk) 14:24, 24 June 2020 (UTC)