Talk:park
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Rfd-redundant "An enclosed parcel of land stocked with animals for hunting, which one may have by prescription or royal grant." seems redundant to "A tract of ground kept in its natural state, about or adjacent to a residence, as for the preservation of game, for walking, riding, or the like." Thryduulf (talk) 11:21, 28 July 2010 (UTC)
- They don't seem redundant. The challenged definition says nothing about location or the non-hunting uses. The unchallenged one says nothing about "prescription or royal grant" or that the land is stocked for hunting. The definitions may be dated and not written to our preferences, but neither encompasses the other. DCDuring TALK 11:43, 30 July 2010 (UTC)
Kept - no consensus to delete. --EncycloPetey 18:44, 4 July 2011 (UTC)
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Sense: "A space occupied by the animals, wagons, pontoons, and materials of all kinds, as ammunition, ordnance stores, hospital stores, provisions, etc., when brought together; also, the objects themselves; as, a park of wagons, a park of artillery; by extension, an inventory of such materiél, such as a country's tank park or artillery park (rare in US)." I'm guessing this is something to do with military or war? Is it current? historical? Does it need a context label? It certainly needs adjusting as it doesn't quite make sense as it stands. Thryduulf (talk) 11:19, 28 July 2010 (UTC)
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Rfv-sense "A grassy basin surrounded by mountains." Context, US. As an American, I've never seen it. If it exists, I suspect it's a specialized usage that should be clarified by quotations.--Prosfilaes (talk) 02:15, 15 October 2015 (UTC)
- It is in wide use about such landforms in my experience in the northern Rockies in the US, but probably elsewhere in the US West. The animated TV show South Park gets its name from such a place southwest of Denver, through which I have driven. AHD has "A broad, fairly level valley between mountain ranges: the high parks of the Rocky Mountains. I wonder if the word is of French origin.
- Our definition has two elements that I question: "grassy" and "surrounded". Though the flat portion of parks can be grassy, sometimes it is more an alpine meadow with little grass. And such basins are at most partially "surrounded by mountains", since there is always an opening for water drainage.
- In any event the definition would benefit from citations. DCDuring TALK 14:11, 15 October 2015 (UTC)
- I can't easily find varied citations to add to the entry, and it's not a word I would use, but google books:"high parks" (to borrow AHD's usage) shows that it is in very wide use in general. —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 16:53, 13 November 2015 (UTC)
- I have added what I think is a good definition for what was probably intended and provided five citations therefor. I don't think good cites can be found to support the elements "grassy" and "surrounded by" in the challenged definition. DCDuring TALK 23:55, 13 November 2015 (UTC)
- I think you're being too literal with "surrounded by"; it's not as absolute as you imply, I think, and a high valley would be surrounded by mountains. I thank you for the gathering of citations. I note that many of them say so-called; I think there is something we should say lexicographically about that, if it's not just a data artifact, but I'm not sure what. In any case, I think this is clearly closeable as an RFV.--Prosfilaes (talk) 00:32, 14 November 2015 (UTC)
- I think in a definiens some care should be taken to avoid relying on tertiary senses of words. I cannot find the sense you invoke in MWOnline which offers the following definitions of surround:
- 1a (1) : to enclose on all sides : envelop <the crowd surrounded her> (2) : to enclose so as to cut off communication or retreat : invest
- b : to form or be a member of the entourage of <flatterers who surround the king>
- c : to constitute part of the environment of <surrounded by poverty>
- d : to extend around the margin or edge of : encircle <a wall surrounds the old city>
- 2 : to cause to be surrounded by something <surrounded himself with friends>
- Sense 1a(1) seems to be the only relevant sense. It seems to be the only sense MW has for real spatial relationships. DCDuring TALK 01:49, 14 November 2015 (UTC)
- It's hard to imagine any area surrounded by mountains in the completely enclosed sense. The first two uses of "surrounded by mountains" in Google Books that I could pull up a map of are Jackson Hole, WY and Mountain Meadow, UT, both of which have a creek running out of them. I'm hard put to find a better way to state that they have mountains all around them.--Prosfilaes (talk) 04:49, 14 November 2015 (UTC)
- I know this is a hard term for which to cite less common definitions. Are either of those places referred to as parks, even in sources not valid for formal attestation? Do they fit within the definition I've cited, perhaps with modification? DCDuring TALK 11:50, 14 November 2015 (UTC)
- The places that I know are called parks are all in Colorado: South Park (Park County, Colorado), Middle Park (Colorado basin), North Park (Colorado basin), High Park west of Fort Collins, site of High Park fire, also High Park near Cripple Creek, but one of the cites refers to such a place near Mount Rainier, in Washington. DCDuring TALK 12:29, 14 November 2015 (UTC)
- I know this is a hard term for which to cite less common definitions. Are either of those places referred to as parks, even in sources not valid for formal attestation? Do they fit within the definition I've cited, perhaps with modification? DCDuring TALK 11:50, 14 November 2015 (UTC)
- It's hard to imagine any area surrounded by mountains in the completely enclosed sense. The first two uses of "surrounded by mountains" in Google Books that I could pull up a map of are Jackson Hole, WY and Mountain Meadow, UT, both of which have a creek running out of them. I'm hard put to find a better way to state that they have mountains all around them.--Prosfilaes (talk) 04:49, 14 November 2015 (UTC)
- I think you're being too literal with "surrounded by"; it's not as absolute as you imply, I think, and a high valley would be surrounded by mountains. I thank you for the gathering of citations. I note that many of them say so-called; I think there is something we should say lexicographically about that, if it's not just a data artifact, but I'm not sure what. In any case, I think this is clearly closeable as an RFV.--Prosfilaes (talk) 00:32, 14 November 2015 (UTC)
- I have added what I think is a good definition for what was probably intended and provided five citations therefor. I don't think good cites can be found to support the elements "grassy" and "surrounded by" in the challenged definition. DCDuring TALK 23:55, 13 November 2015 (UTC)
- RFV-passed. Entry was revised, cited, and detagged a while ago. - -sche (discuss) 07:58, 26 January 2016 (UTC)
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Rfv-sense To engage in romantic or sexual activities inside a nonmoving vehicle. Oxlade2000 (talk) 11:14, 19 March 2021 (UTC)
- I am familiar with this meaning, but in go parking. Leasnam (talk) 11:21, 19 March 2021 (UTC)
- It looks cited, even if you separate out the ones that use "go parking". Kiwima (talk) 19:16, 19 March 2021 (UTC)
- Is engaging in sex in the back of a taxicab caught in a Manhattan traffic jam also parking? And what about romantic adventures while aboard a docked cruise ship? I think the sense of “vehicle” needs to be restricted to conveyances under the control of the involved actors. --Lambiam 09:54, 20 March 2021 (UTC)
- Now we just need an elegant, terse way of saying that. DCDuring (talk) 21:00, 20 March 2021 (UTC)
- Not a contender in the Annual Terse Elegance Contest, I’m afraid, but the best I could concoct: To engage in romantic or sexual activities in a vehicle after driving it to and halting at a suitable spot. I suppose that the usual sense is with a couple as the actors, but there might be uses for threesomes or for solo sex, so I guess we should not be more specific. Should we label this as a euphemism, like “asking someone up for a coffee” is often a euphemism for propositioning? --Lambiam 11:39, 21 March 2021 (UTC)
- I always thought the archetypal propositions were: "Would you like to come in for a drink?" and, more of a parody, "Would you like to take a look at my etchings?".
- How about instead of "in a vehicle […] suitable spot", "typically in a car parked in a secluded spot". DCDuring (talk) 21:22, 21 March 2021 (UTC)
- "Vehicle" seems too general, "car" is too specific, "typically" allows for other possibilities.
- AHD has: "Slang To engage in kissing and caressing in a vehicle stopped in a secluded spot." I'm having trouble finding another OneLook dictionary, either US or UK, that covers this. I can't imagine that OED would miss this. DCDuring (talk) 21:33, 21 March 2021 (UTC)
- A US expression of the 50s and 60s that covered this was "submarine-race watching". DCDuring (talk) 21:35, 21 March 2021 (UTC)
- Not a contender in the Annual Terse Elegance Contest, I’m afraid, but the best I could concoct: To engage in romantic or sexual activities in a vehicle after driving it to and halting at a suitable spot. I suppose that the usual sense is with a couple as the actors, but there might be uses for threesomes or for solo sex, so I guess we should not be more specific. Should we label this as a euphemism, like “asking someone up for a coffee” is often a euphemism for propositioning? --Lambiam 11:39, 21 March 2021 (UTC)
- Now we just need an elegant, terse way of saying that. DCDuring (talk) 21:00, 20 March 2021 (UTC)
- Is engaging in sex in the back of a taxicab caught in a Manhattan traffic jam also parking? And what about romantic adventures while aboard a docked cruise ship? I think the sense of “vehicle” needs to be restricted to conveyances under the control of the involved actors. --Lambiam 09:54, 20 March 2021 (UTC)
RFV-passed Kiwima (talk) 19:55, 29 March 2021 (UTC)