Talk:maple leaf

RFD discussion: February–August 2023

The following discussion has been moved from Wiktionary:Requests for deletion (permalink).

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maple leaf

Maple Leaf

Sense 2: "A national symbol of Canada." about as useful as circle being defined as "a national symbol of South Korea"... Ioaxxere (talk) 16:11, 28 February 2023 (UTC)

Collins says it's the "national flag of Canada", which can't be denied. DonnanZ (talk) 16:40, 28 February 2023 (UTC)

@Donnanz per your replies I think you're missing the point of the RFVs. No dictionary that you've linked has the symbol as a separate sense. Ioaxxere (talk) 18:21, 28 February 2023 (UTC)

Flag of Canada

The flag has a stylised maple leaf on it, whatever. DonnanZ (talk) 18:47, 28 February 2023 (UTC)

There is also the Lexico ref already attached to the entry, word-for-word with the printed Oxford. DonnanZ (talk) 16:58, 28 February 2023 (UTC)

I'd go with alt capitalization of Maple Leaf for that one. Drapetomanic (talk) 17:13, 28 February 2023 (UTC)

I wouldn't be opposed to a sense "the flag of Canada". If it exists it should be easy to find examples of "fly/raise/wave the maple leaf". Ioaxxere (talk) 18:21, 28 February 2023 (UTC)

To have an entry as a spelling mistake for Maple Leaf, it needs to be a common mistake.  --Lambiam 10:41, 1 March 2023 (UTC)

Keep, I'm not sure I understand the point about the circle? Nobody sees an unadorned circle and thinks of South Korea. At any rate, it's not saying that any physical maple leaf also happens to be a symbol of Canada, it's saying that a particular red design which is commonly referred to as a "maple leaf" is a symbol of Canada. Perhaps the wording could be changed to clarify this, but it's similar to sense 3 of leopard. It isn't primarily referring to the physical object that the symbol is based on, as in sense 1. AllenY99 (talk) 09:16, 1 March 2023 (UTC)

I think you can find things with maple leaf symbols on them, like backpacks for Canadians. DonnanZ (talk) 11:20, 1 March 2023 (UTC)

You’re mixing up the term maple leaf with the thing it describes. Theknightwho (talk) 17:31, 2 March 2023 (UTC)

?? DonnanZ (talk) 19:20, 2 March 2023 (UTC)

The disagreement here is about whether the term maple leaf is a symbol of Canada (which is not the same thing as the maple leaf itself). Backpacks with maple leaves on are completely irrelevant to that. Theknightwho (talk) 21:28, 3 March 2023 (UTC)

Not if a Canadian backpacker intentionally buys a maple leaf backpack, or attaches a maple leaf symbol to their backpack, to signify where they're from when travelling abroad. DonnanZ (talk) 22:18, 3 March 2023 (UTC)

And what does that have to do with the term maple leaf? It's not really possible to make this any clearer to you. Theknightwho (talk) 16:31, 4 March 2023 (UTC)

Photographic evidence is obviously required. DonnanZ (talk) 21:38, 4 March 2023 (UTC)

At this point, you have to be trolling. Theknightwho (talk) 22:18, 4 March 2023 (UTC)

?? I have never been accused of trolling. Please explain. DonnanZ (talk) 22:58, 4 March 2023 (UTC)

Looking at the convo, it seems rather evident to me where such allegation would come from. Please allow me to bolden parts of all of User:Theknightwho's responses.

You’re mixing up the term maple leaf with the thing it describes.
The disagreement here is about whether the term maple leaf is a symbol of Canada (which is not the same thing as the maple leaf itself). Backpacks with maple leaves on are completely irrelevant to that.
And what does that have to do with the term maple leaf? It's not really possible to make this any clearer to you.

After saying this three times, while you are still going on about hiking and photographic evidence without addressing the points does appear trollish. You are on a dictionary. We talk about words and junk. So please speak about the words. Thank you.

I hope this helps. Akalendos (talk) 21:06, 24 March 2023 (UTC)

Delete. Similarly to what I argue above for #bald eagle, while the maple leaf is indeed a national symbol of Canada, the meaning of the term maple leaf is not “a national symbol of Canada”.  --Lambiam 17:34, 2 March 2023 (UTC)

Leaning Delete. Covered at Maple Leaf already, though I don't think the "circle" comparison is that great at all... AG202 (talk) 18:55, 2 March 2023 (UTC)

Strong keep. Unless we're gonna delete apple pie and stars and stripes for parity. The aggressive US-centrism on Wiktionary is getting extremely tiresome. There have been multiple instances of Canadian entries being selectively deleted while the American equivalent was retained (e.g. Royal Canadian Mounted Police vs. Federal Bureau of Investigation and Italian-Canadian vs Italian American). WordyAndNerdy (talk) 05:37, 6 March 2023 (UTC)

Counterpoint Apple pie figuratively represents Americanness as a figurative expression, beyond being a national symbol. Stars and stripes are included because it is used as a synonym for the flag. Would this be parity?

No comment on the comparisons, although these choices certainly could have been biased. Akalendos (talk) 20:43, 24 March 2023 (UTC)

Keep (I didn't vote before). I sympathise with WordyAndNerdy about US-centrism, US spellings take precedence over British spellings too, which often annoys me. DonnanZ (talk) 10:33, 6 March 2023 (UTC)

Comment bald eagle's entry is about a national symbol, while Stars and Stripes is a nickname (term) for the US flag, which happens to be a national symbol.

Looking at the one quotation provided for our term, maple leaf, it is used as the flag. However, the so-called definition "A national symbol of Canada" makes it out to be more like the former. Akalendos (talk) 15:24, 26 March 2023 (UTC)

The text on Maple Leaf is more accurate in this regard, as well as having more appropriate capitalisation. Akalendos (talk) 15:29, 26 March 2023 (UTC)

Perhaps this is a question for RFV? If this is really used in the same way as apple pie then it should be kept (with an improved def). But I don't think people really say things like "O Canada is a maple leaf", which is what the definition as currently written implies. This, that and the other (talk) 10:07, 20 April 2023 (UTC)

• I would change it to Alternative form of Maple Leaf just to cover such uses. FWIW, the OED has as one of their definitions "The five-lobed palmate leaf of the sugar maple, or a stylized representation of it, used as the national emblem of Canada. Hence also (with capital initials): the Canadian flag, which features this emblem". Ƿidsiþ 09:51, 5 May 2023 (UTC)

RFD-resolved per Widsith. This, that and the other (talk) 01:55, 29 August 2023 (UTC)