Talk:in the trouser department

RFD discussion: November–December 2014

The following discussion has been moved from Wiktionary:Requests for deletion (permalink).

This discussion is no longer live and is left here as an archive. Please do not modify this conversation, but feel free to discuss its conclusions.

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in the trouser department

WF sock made this a few years ago. Perhaps wasn't thinking straight. --Type56op9 (talk) 14:45, 16 November 2014 (UTC)

Why should we delete this? It has 4 citations and doesn't seem to be an SOP. Rædi Stædi Yæti {-skriv til mig-} 14:50, 16 November 2014 (UTC)

• Keep: verifiable and not SOP, so passes CFI. Also, I'm wondering if in the...department is a valid construction. Purplebackpack89 15:27, 16 November 2014 (UTC)
• Keep. There is clearly no definition now in the entries for either trouser or, for that matter, department that makes this euphemism SoP. If someone can define and attest senses of the component terms that would make this SoP, I'd be happy to consider changing my vote. DCDuring TALK 19:32, 16 November 2014 (UTC)

  @DCDuring, given the discussion below, do you have an opinion on moving this to trouser department? Cheers! bd2412 T 13:50, 22 November 2014 (UTC)

  @BD2412 As I said below, "Wouldn't it have to be trouser department to include the last cite (and the many others that have another article, predeterminer, determiner, and/or intervening adjective)?" Sorry I didn't explicitly change my vote to Move to trouser department. DCDuring TALK 15:44, 22 November 2014 (UTC)

• "An expression is idiomatic if its full meaning cannot be easily derived from the meaning of its separate components." So keep. Renard Migrant (talk) 20:32, 16 November 2014 (UTC)
• Move: I'd like to float the idea this should be just the trouser department. That's how Knickers in a Twist: A Dictionary of British Slang lists it. Irvine Welsh's Filth says "The mouth department and the trouser department are well out of synchronisation in the not-so-superstore that is Ray Lennox, I kid."[1] Three Things About Me says "His trouser department took a dive. Rose was as confident and beautiful as ever."[2] Genesis: The Complete Guide to Their Music says "'The Shorts.' Not a reference to the band's trouser department, but the brevity of the tracks on their best selling compilation The Way We Walk(1992)".[3] Blowing It says "The front trouser department would surely be the first place to seek out evidence of intent when faced with a potential stalker." Etc.--Prosfilaes (talk) 22:19, 16 November 2014 (UTC)

  Wouldn't it have to be trouser department to include the last cite (and the many others that have another article, predeterminer, determiner, and/or intervening adjective)? DCDuring TALK 03:41, 17 November 2014 (UTC)

  What he said. If you're dropping "in", drop "the". Purplebackpack89 04:58, 17 November 2014 (UTC)

• Keep. Other "department" constructions might arguably be SOP, but this one is definitely idiomatic, as it's not self-evident that "trouser department" is intended to be a euphemism for "groin." To the uninitiated, "he leaves a lot to be desired in the trouser department" could be interpreted to mean that the man in question wears out-of-style/ill-fitting/dirty trousers, etc. -Cloudcuckoolander (talk) 10:28, 17 November 2014 (UTC)
• Move to trouser department and word as a noun. "In the" is transparent when prepended to such a noun. Leave the current title as a redirect. bd2412 T 14:53, 17 November 2014 (UTC)
• How often is 'trouser department' used without 'in the'? If it's very rarely I'd sooner keep it as it is. Renard Migrant (talk) 18:13, 17 November 2014 (UTC)

• I found four cites of "trouser department" (in this sense--also found in the literal sense) without too much work. It's a tiny sample, but the first couple pages of google books:"trouser department" shows me 11 literal uses, 5 figurative uses of "in the trouser department" and 3 of just "trouser department" (including "going for the trouser department"). (And one dictionary entry for "trouser department".) So it's definitely not "vary rare".--Prosfilaes (talk) 21:20, 17 November 2014 (UTC)

This entry should definitely be deleted and possibly trouser department created. But better than that would be to create a new sense of department to cover usages like this:

Did something in the love department just recently happen to you?

The arms are also a good length as sometimes jumpers are a little short in the sleeve department.

If you're feeling a little out of sorts in the stomach department, you might want to try this potent tea.

He looked into Mona's eyes, seeing a mysterious woman, an unknown for him on several occasions in the feelings department.

Older men need to exercise regularly to keep up on the sex department.

--Hekaheka (talk) 13:05, 18 November 2014 (UTC)

"In the trouser department" is euphemistic in a different way to those examples. "In the sleeve department" literally means "with respect to sleeves", but "In the trouser department" does not mean "with respect to trousers". (See also Wiktionary:Tea room#In the [YOUR ITEM HERE] department) Smurrayinchester (talk) 13:12, 18 November 2014 (UTC)

Read carefuly. I wrote "possibly trouser department created". "In the trouser department" is "in the" + "trouser department". Or, would you add a separate entry for all the following:

He was aware that some men were concerned about the size of their equipment, but usually their anxiety focussed on the trouser department.

Lee thinks with his trouser department!

I also felt a little stir underneath me from his trouser department before turning around quickly and blushing again.

Plus, we need the new sense of "department". This guy wasn't thinking his penis when writing this:

I tried not to look at the things I really don't need and focused on the trouser department of my outfit.

Further, is this the only occasion where "trouser" is used to refer to "penis"? Do we need a new sense for "trouser"? If we do, also "trouser department" becomes SOP. --Hekaheka (talk) 07:00, 19 November 2014 (UTC)

No, I just assumed that when you said "But better than that would be to create a new sense of department to cover usages like this", you were suggesting that if we had this sense of department, trouser department would automatically become SOP, which I was refuting. Smurrayinchester (talk) 12:31, 19 November 2014 (UTC)

I have boldly moved this to trouser department, and refactored it as a noun. bd2412 T 16:15, 30 November 2014 (UTC)

Is there any objection to calling this one resolved, at this point? bd2412 T 21:03, 8 December 2014 (UTC)

Striking as resolved. bd2412 T 17:56, 16 December 2014 (UTC)