Talk:greedy as a Jew

RFD discussion: November 2016

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greedy as a Jew

Not idiomatic: you could be greedy as many things. DTLHS (talk) 23:10, 3 November 2016 (UTC)

peruse this list: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English-language_idioms, would you say that "bite the bullet" is not an idiom, since you can bite many things? Rasptr (talk)

No, since bullets aren't a thing that you normally bite. DTLHS (talk) 23:14, 3 November 2016 (UTC)

Is there any relevance to your comment, Rasptr? Because I'm not seeing any. Renard Migrant (talk) 23:16, 3 November 2016 (UTC)

DTLHS: but jews are normally greedy? that's racist Carl Bildt (talk) (Rasptr)

Is there some reason you've created a second account just to make this comment? Renard Migrant (talk) 23:27, 3 November 2016 (UTC)

Don't be willfully dense. And read about the sense and reference distinction. DTLHS (talk) 23:28, 3 November 2016 (UTC)

is there some reason you created a second account, Mglovesfun? DTLHS: alright i'll read that, just for you. Carl Bildt (talk)

Yes. But what relevance? I will repeat the question: Is there some reason you've created a second account just to make this comment? Renard Migrant (talk) 00:08, 4 November 2016 (UTC)

yes, there is a reason, but what relevance? Carl Bildt (talk)

Maybe if you have nothing about 'greedy as a Jew' to say you should just stop talking. Maybe we could take about socialism in the 19th century on my talk page, given you have nothing relevant to say whatsoever on this issue. Renard Migrant (talk) 00:17, 4 November 2016 (UTC)

how is my new account relevant? you're not discussing 'greedy as a Jew' either, and i'm not the one who created this request. i've since added additional sources, solidifying the validity of this expression. i can understand that it might make you feel impotent or even cuckolded to see an article -- to you offensive -- being added completely according to the rules, but it's not cause for deletion. frankly, i have too many other things to juggle right now to have time for this. Carl Bildt (talk) 00:21, 4 November 2016 (UTC)

No I have no opposition to this entry. I was merely trying to keep the discussion on the issue of 'greedy as a Jew', which I have achieved as you're now off to do something else. Renard Migrant (talk) 00:22, 4 November 2016 (UTC)

i'll note this down in this little book i have, "Renard's Achivements - 2016", "After veering the discussion first into the creation of my new account, and then into 19th century jewry, he finally decided to stick to the topic. i therefore award Renard two gold stars out of five possible for today. -- Carl" Carl Bildt (talk)

• The definition is hardly enlightening. DonnanZ (talk) 00:33, 4 November 2016 (UTC)

perhaps you should improve it then? Carl Bildt (talk)

domanz, Sonofcawdrey has done me a favor by improving it, so are you quite finished with your little show? Carl Bildt (talk)

• Have improved def. But am curious about "not comparable" ... the comparative exists, greedier than ..., but not the superlative. What do we usually do with such cases? (oh, and on basis of evidence provided, keep) - Sonofcawdrey (talk) 00:46, 4 November 2016 (UTC)

• I don't think "colder than ice" is actually a comparative for "cold as ice" (even though some people add them that way). It's a separate form. Equinox ◑ 00:51, 4 November 2016 (UTC)

Yes, treating as a separate form is not a bad way to do it. I note a recent dict. published (Moore 2016) had game as Ned Kelly and gamer than Ned Kelly as separate entries. - Sonofcawdrey (talk) 05:21, 4 November 2016 (UTC)

• Redundant, not idiomatic (Greedy as a {offensive racial stereotype} just means "greedy", it's barely even an intensifier: so it basically breaks down to "as greedy as a greedy person", with gratuitous offense thrown in), and generally just no. (To beat a dead horse: to "bite the bullet" does not mean actually clamping one's teeth on a lead projectile, any more than "beating a dead horse" means attacking an equine corpse. They are idiomatic. "Greedy as a Jew" is not.) *Delete* with all speed. However many citations are available is irrelevant. --Catsidhe ^{(verba, facta)} 00:49, 4 November 2016 (UTC)

we could change it from (idiomatic) to (simile) Carl Bildt (talk)

Oh, are we Similepedia now? Are all things which are like other things worthy of dictionary entries? You're trolling. --Catsidhe ^{(verba, facta)} 01:03, 4 November 2016 (UTC)

i think you take these matters too lightly, catsihde. firstly, here is a list of similes, [1]. secondly, i do not agree that 'greedy as a Jew' is equivalent to 'greedy as a [slur]', for example, Google Books has no results for 'greedy as a nigger', 'greedy as a woman', nor 'greedy as a sperg', those are all racist, misogynist and ableist slurs, but they are not in common use. 'greedy as a Jew' is. Carl Bildt (talk) 01:10, 4 November 2016 (UTC)

• Delete is a transparent SOP simile. I also don't find this one to be all that common - I get a grand total of four Google Books hits, of which two are merely mentions. We might consider, however, adding a definition to Jew for the use of the word as a slur implying a greedy person; see, e.g., 2010, Matthew S. Hiley, Hubris Falls, page 111: “Jesus, Williams, you're such a Jew,” Jimmy said in an annoyed, high-pitched tone. “Have you ever just paid a check, or do you always make an ass of yourself?” Citations for "greedy as a Jew" would also support such a sense. bd2412 T 14:15, 4 November 2016 (UTC)

Delete. Because it's considered offensive, the only people who use this are those who actually believe that Jews are inherently greedy, and therefore a good model of greediness to compare things with. For them, it's just a normal simile, like "hard as a rock", "big as a whale", "tall as a tree". The offensiveness of the phrase is beside the point, since we routinely keep far worse. Chuck Entz (talk) 19:12, 4 November 2016 (UTC)

Delete. What he said: not idiomatic, and you could be greedy as anything that you want to consider greedy. BTW, I don't think offensiveness is relevant at all. You can't exclude words and expressions from a dictionary just because they may be offensive. Mihia (talk) 21:24, 4 November 2016 (UTC)

• Asbtain: is it even attested (WT:ATTEST)? google books:"greedy as a Jew". I prefer to keep common similes, but this simile is not common, and maybe not even attested in use to convey meaning. --Dan Polansky (talk) 16:43, 5 November 2016 (UTC)

Delete, and stop humouring this troll. — Kleio (t · c) 16:50, 5 November 2016 (UTC)

• It's an obvious SOP and barely attested outside Stormfront, which doesn't meet CFI. So it's not a common simile and it should be deleted. Lingo Bingo Dingo (talk) 09:36, 7 November 2016 (UTC)
• Okay - not sure about my previous keep ... if it doesn't meet CFI, then it should go .... otherwise I am not sure - and this does bring up some interesting points. First, I do not think it is policy to delete items because they are offensive - just label them clearly as offensive. As for it being SOP, would that not imply Jews are actually greedy? which of course the aren't, they are merely reckoned so by long-standing racist reckoning, but you would need to know this to understand the idiom, and it is scoped for greed in the financial sense. As someone above pointed out, you can't substitute Jew for any other racial slur and have the phrase make sense (well, can't think of any substitutes right now). Anyhow, I change to abstain. - Sonofcawdrey (talk) 02:25, 8 November 2016 (UTC)

Deleted, as we have entered snowball territory with that last reversal of opinion. bd2412 T 17:30, 8 November 2016 (UTC)