Talk:aufkonzentrieren
Add topicLatest comment: 2 years ago by Fytcha
@Fytcha Is this conjugation correct? Benwing2 (talk) 05:05, 5 March 2022 (UTC)
- @Benwing2: I don't know this word but my intuition says this has to be split, however that of course sounds weird too because of the potential for confusion with konzentrieren + preo auf. (Notifying Matthias Buchmeier, -sche, Atitarev, Jberkel, Mahagaja, Fay Freak): Does anyone find attestations for the split conjugation? — Fytcha〈 T | L | C 〉 08:30, 5 March 2022 (UTC)
- Intuitively correct. Fay Freak (talk) 13:54, 5 March 2022 (UTC)
- @Benwing2, Fay Freak: Thinking about it again, I'd definitely say aufzukonzentrieren instead of zu aufkonzentrieren, which should prove that the split conjugation is correct and the unsplit one is wrong. — Fytcha〈 T | L | C 〉 12:29, 6 March 2022 (UTC)
- Yes, but the table does not contain zu forms. The split one is more likely, and definitely more common. What I was thinking about with the term “split” is the form aufgekonzentriert, which seems not existing. This follows the first pattern of anerkennen, and I do not even find the second one of it for this, no 3rd person singular for aufkonzentriert, which is possibly due to rarity: Jstor does not even have a single hit for aufkonzentriert and aufkonzentrierte. Still difficult though to even find finite forms! Maybe it only exists as adjective aufkonzentriert while as a verb one uses konzentrieren + auf (eine gewisse Konzentration)? Can't tell, as konzentrieren + auf in the common parlance blurs the picture. Fay Freak (talk) 14:35, 6 March 2022 (UTC)
- Agreed that attesting its finite forms is hard (maybe we need a label (chiefly nonfinite)? I actually think the reason for this is because "konzentrieren auf" and forms already have a different meaning as you point out as well), but I think the existence of aufzukonzentrieren proves that there's more than just konzentrieren + auf and an adj. aufkonzentriert; the kind of auf that initiates a prepositional object never glues to the zu-infinitive, that only happens for split verbs AFAIK. That's also the reason why there's no zu-infinitive in the conjugation table; for it to generate aufzukonzentrieren you have to parameterize the table as
{{de-conj|auf.konzentrieren}}:
- Agreed that attesting its finite forms is hard (maybe we need a label (chiefly nonfinite)? I actually think the reason for this is because "konzentrieren auf" and forms already have a different meaning as you point out as well), but I think the existence of aufzukonzentrieren proves that there's more than just konzentrieren + auf and an adj. aufkonzentriert; the kind of auf that initiates a prepositional object never glues to the zu-infinitive, that only happens for split verbs AFAIK. That's also the reason why there's no zu-infinitive in the conjugation table; for it to generate aufzukonzentrieren you have to parameterize the table as
- Yes, but the table does not contain zu forms. The split one is more likely, and definitely more common. What I was thinking about with the term “split” is the form aufgekonzentriert, which seems not existing. This follows the first pattern of anerkennen, and I do not even find the second one of it for this, no 3rd person singular for aufkonzentriert, which is possibly due to rarity: Jstor does not even have a single hit for aufkonzentriert and aufkonzentrierte. Still difficult though to even find finite forms! Maybe it only exists as adjective aufkonzentriert while as a verb one uses konzentrieren + auf (eine gewisse Konzentration)? Can't tell, as konzentrieren + auf in the common parlance blurs the picture. Fay Freak (talk) 14:35, 6 March 2022 (UTC)
| infinitive | aufkonzentrieren | ||||
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| present participle | aufkonzentrierend | ||||
| past participle | aufkonzentriert | ||||
| zu-infinitive | aufzukonzentrieren | ||||
| auxiliary | haben | ||||
| indicative | subjunctive | ||||
| singular | plural | singular | plural | ||
| present | ich konzentriere auf | wir konzentrieren auf | i | ich konzentriere auf | wir konzentrieren auf |
| du konzentrierst auf | ihr konzentriert auf | du konzentrierest auf | ihr konzentrieret auf | ||
| er konzentriert auf | sie konzentrieren auf | er konzentriere auf | sie konzentrieren auf | ||
| preterite | ich konzentrierte auf | wir konzentrierten auf | ii | ich konzentrierte auf1 | wir konzentrierten auf1 |
| du konzentriertest auf | ihr konzentriertet auf | du konzentriertest auf1 | ihr konzentriertet auf1 | ||
| er konzentrierte auf | sie konzentrierten auf | er konzentrierte auf1 | sie konzentrierten auf1 | ||
| imperative | konzentrier auf (du) konzentriere auf (du) |
konzentriert auf (ihr) | |||
1Rare except in very formal contexts; alternative in würde normally preferred.
1Rare except in very formal contexts; alternative in würde normally preferred.
— Fytcha〈 T | L | C 〉 15:01, 6 March 2022 (UTC)