Talk:𐌼𐌰𐌽𐍅𐌹𐌸𐌰
Add topicLatest comment: 8 years ago by Metaknowledge in topic RFV discussion: October–November 2016
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Tagged but not listed. I added an attestation, but I think the rfv process demands it be posted here for a week nonetheless. — Kleio (t · c) 15:46, 31 October 2016 (UTC)
- Not necessarily a week but if someone could double-check it, yes. @CodeCat? Renard Migrant (talk) 17:01, 31 October 2016 (UTC)
- It looks ok, but I don't think we should be using the KJV to translate Gothic. The translation should reflect the original Gothic as close as possible, i.e. we should be supplying a translation of the Gothic itself, not of the Greek on which the Gothic is based. —CodeCat 17:11, 31 October 2016 (UTC)
- That's actually a pretty good point, though it'd be very time-consuming to provide a whole new translation for each and every quote that has been added. I've done it before, but only out of necessity with certain words from the Arezzo/Naples deeds (e.g. 𐍃𐌺𐌹𐌻𐌻𐌹𐌲𐌲𐍃) and the Gothic Calendar. Probably strive to get as many original translations in where possible though (esp. for FWOTDs), which is (besides yielding a more exact translation) also a good exercise. Still, it should be noted that our understanding of many Gothic words derives primarily from comparison with the Greek text which Ulfilas used as basis for his translation, so while it is imperfect, the KJV is a reasonable substitute nonetheless. — Kleio (t · c) 17:21, 31 October 2016 (UTC)
- I usually take KJV as a starting point, because it's public domain and a very literal translation of the Greek, but then adapt it to the Gothic as necessary. It doesn't usually take much adapting. —Aɴɢʀ (talk) 18:07, 31 October 2016 (UTC)
- I would also adapt the English to modern usage, as necessary, replacing things like "thou" with "you". —CodeCat 18:12, 31 October 2016 (UTC)
- KIeio, if you don't want to adapt the translations to the Gothic/modern English, could you keep tagging them with (KJV)? That will allow others to find them and fix them up as we have time. —CodeCat 18:18, 31 October 2016 (UTC)
- Yea, I made adding the (KJV) my standard practice a while ago. I'm curious how you would easily find them though? The search bar yields many non-Gothic entries that also include that tag. Anyhow, I like Angr's approach, and think I might keep an eye out for cases where an adaptation is obviously desirable. I think adaptations to modern English for purposes of legibility are only necessary where difficult archaisms are involved, though. The language of the KJV is often quite beautiful. — Kleio (t · c) 18:39, 31 October 2016 (UTC)
- @KIeio You could also use a translation like the NRSV, which is often quite close to the KJV but has obvious benefits. Lingo Bingo Dingo (talk) 14:11, 2 November 2016 (UTC)
- Yea, I made adding the (KJV) my standard practice a while ago. I'm curious how you would easily find them though? The search bar yields many non-Gothic entries that also include that tag. Anyhow, I like Angr's approach, and think I might keep an eye out for cases where an adaptation is obviously desirable. I think adaptations to modern English for purposes of legibility are only necessary where difficult archaisms are involved, though. The language of the KJV is often quite beautiful. — Kleio (t · c) 18:39, 31 October 2016 (UTC)
- I usually take KJV as a starting point, because it's public domain and a very literal translation of the Greek, but then adapt it to the Gothic as necessary. It doesn't usually take much adapting. —Aɴɢʀ (talk) 18:07, 31 October 2016 (UTC)
- That's actually a pretty good point, though it'd be very time-consuming to provide a whole new translation for each and every quote that has been added. I've done it before, but only out of necessity with certain words from the Arezzo/Naples deeds (e.g. 𐍃𐌺𐌹𐌻𐌻𐌹𐌲𐌲𐍃) and the Gothic Calendar. Probably strive to get as many original translations in where possible though (esp. for FWOTDs), which is (besides yielding a more exact translation) also a good exercise. Still, it should be noted that our understanding of many Gothic words derives primarily from comparison with the Greek text which Ulfilas used as basis for his translation, so while it is imperfect, the KJV is a reasonable substitute nonetheless. — Kleio (t · c) 17:21, 31 October 2016 (UTC)
- It looks ok, but I don't think we should be using the KJV to translate Gothic. The translation should reflect the original Gothic as close as possible, i.e. we should be supplying a translation of the Gothic itself, not of the Greek on which the Gothic is based. —CodeCat 17:11, 31 October 2016 (UTC)
- RFV passed. —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 23:34, 23 November 2016 (UTC)