Reconstruction talk:Proto-Japonic/mənə

Etymology

@Mellohi!, re: diff, there may be a basis for the OCH derivation. See also related discussion regarding Proto-Japonic and OCH at Category_talk:Proto-Japonic_terms_borrowed_from_Old_Chinese#Question. ‑‑ Eiríkr Útlendi │^{Tala við mig} 17:43, 2 December 2019 (UTC)

@Eirikr, Mellohi! Would the use of {{noncog}} be more suitable for possible/suspected borrowings? Anyway, I think it is unlikely for a final /d/ or /t/ as in 物 (OC *mɯd) to transform into a medial /n/. KevinUp (talk) 19:44, 3 December 2019 (UTC)

There are other members of that same phonetic series that end in /-n/. Japonic also has long had an aversion to final consonants, so a shift from a final in OCH to a medial -- but still part of the final mora -- would not be at all surprising. A lack of native final consonants in Japonic could also lead to a final voiced dental stop /-d/ being parsed as a voiced dental nasal, especially if the final /-d/ were unreleased.

I feel like I've run across other examples of similar shifts, but it's been a while. I'll dig a bit. ‑‑ Eiríkr Útlendi │^{Tala við mig} 20:13, 3 December 2019 (UTC)

@Eirikr: I would like to see more examples of final {{IPAchar|/-d/}] being parsed as medial /n/. By the way, do you think {{noncog|lang}} would be more suitable for possible/suspected borrowings rather than the usual {{bor|jpx-pro|lang}}? I don't think it is a good idea to categorize these borrowings, unless we set up a separate category for possible/unconfirmed borrowings on Wiktionary. KevinUp (talk) 06:09, 4 December 2019 (UTC)

• @KevinUp: <nods/> I like that idea, using {{noncog}}. I presume we would use {{bor}} or {{der}} or similar if we find that academic consensus is moving in that direction? ‑‑ Eiríkr Útlendi │^{Tala við mig} 07:23, 4 December 2019 (UTC)

Yeah, {{bor}} or {{der}} can be used if there is some academic consensus on the matter. Otherwise {{noncog}} can be used for suspected borrowings or possible cognates that lack references. KevinUp (talk) 08:01, 4 December 2019 (UTC)