Appendix talk:Swedish verbs

Old 2nd person plural

The table differentiates between "past indicative singular" and "past indicative plural 1st and 3rd person". Wondering what past indicative plural 2nd person might be, I looked into the source and found the following:

Page 549:

1 De föråldrade former som fortfarande marginellt kan förekomma är:

presens pluralis (§ 37): kasta, böja, så, binda

presens pluralis andra person (§ 37 not 2): kasten, böjen, sån, binden

preteritum pluralis (§ 39): bundo

preteritum pluralis andra person (§ 39 not 1): bunden

imperativ pluralis (§ 40 not 1): kasten, böjen, sån, binden

imperativ pluralis första person (§ 40 not 1): låtom

optativ (§ 42): kaste, böje, binde

Page 551:

2 Vid återgivning av äldre religiöst språk och i pastischer förekommer i sällsynta fall en mycket ålderdomlig form med suffixet -en (efter stam som slutar på betonad vokal: -n) i andra person pluralis, bildad till samma stam som a-pluralen. Den tar det äldre pronomenet I snarare än ni som subjekt: I skolen finna ett barn i en krubba. Veten I icke att han är här? Ären I förskräckta däröver?

Page 552:

1 I andra person pluralis förekom tidigare en numera obruklig form på -en, t.ex. I gåv-en.

OK, so this adds the information about the endings used while "ye" was still "I", not "ni". But what was used between then and now? Ni kaste or ni kasta? Ni bunde or ni bundo? 2A02:A310:8238:6800:1C55:2E21:79F0:410A 16:23, 29 June 2021 (UTC)

@Mårtensås — surjection ⟨??⟩ 16:24, 29 June 2021 (UTC)

Svenska Akademiens Ordlista from 1889 says this:

Ni pron. pers.; nyttjas med verbet i sg., äfven när ordet användes som tilltal till flere, dock förekommer det för detta fall i hvardaglig stil också med verbet i pl., t. e. ni ären, ni finnen (stundom alldeles språkvidrigt ni äro, ni finna), men i vårdad skrift brukas I ären, I finnen.

In English:

Ni personal pronoun; used with the verb in the singular, even when the word is used to adress multiple people, though it in this case in casual style also occurs with the verb in the plural, for example ni ären, ni finnen (sometimes completely incorrectly ni äro, ni finna), but in formal writing is used I ären, I finnen.

On Runeberg, I get 467 for "ni äro", 962 for "I ären", 54 for "ni ären" and one for "Ni äre" (but this is actually a hyphenated form of "Ni ärevördige", which has nothing to do with the verb vara). Ni äre thus is basically non-existent in the written language, but it might have existed earlier dialectally.

This question made me think about sometihng though; the Swedish verb templates should probably feature the -en-forms as well, seeing as they were highly present in the written language for almost as long as the plural forms. I might add this later this week. Mårtensås (talk) 18:45, 29 June 2021 (UTC)

Past subjunctives still in use

Would it be possible to provide a list of those subjunctive forms that are still encountered fairly commonly in written Swedish? You mention "vore" and "ginge", and I think "finge" also. Are there more? Thank you. 78.54.3.2 04:18, 23 July 2021 (UTC)

These are really the only three, perhaps bleve too. Vore is still common among all speakers, and finge/ginge sound slightly dated, but many people still use them. ᛙᛆᚱᛐᛁᚿᛌᛆᛌ ᛭ Wiktionary's most active Proto-Norse editor ᛭ Ask me anything 10:55, 23 July 2021 (UTC)